Drop.com $20 off - Lumintop Copper/Brass Tool for $10 - N/A as of 12/10/19

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christoph
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Just got an email from Brett
_*This is Brett with Drop Community Support. I am sorry to hear that you did end up receiving the wrong flashlight.

It looks like we do currently have limited inventory of the Nichia though, so if you could please confirm your shipping address for me I will get a return label created to start this exchange.

I will wait to hear back from you.
Best Regards,
Brett_*

sent email and got postage label

Chris

cyclops
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Awesome! How are you contacting them?

argolite
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Contact them by replying to the original email about the mixup. I expect Drop may only be doing returns and exchanges to US addresses due to higher international shipping costs and customs paperwork.

JiggyJinjo
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argolite wrote:
Contact them by replying to the original email about the mixup. I expect Drop may only be doing returns and exchanges to US addresses due to higher international shipping costs and customs paperwork.

EUW here and that’s exactly what they did. They just told me to keep the light and full refund me

xevious
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Just got mine. Put battery in and nothing. On a lark, I looked at instructions. “Wait a few minutes for the capacitor in the tail switch to charge up.” WTH? Never ever in all the lights I’ve ever owned, required waiting a few minutes.

So I waited. And waited. And waited. 15 mins later, still no light. Switched batteries. Still no joy. Anybody else here have a DOA?

EDIT: Well, I checked both Eneloop AAA batteries. One was 1.28v, the other 1.26v. They were both operable in my Jetbeam-U and Fenix L0D… but that must be because they’re not current regulated. So I charged ‘em up. Once one cell reached 1.4v, I took it off the charger and put it in the Tool. Now the light works. Seems to be not enough juice to go beyond low & medium. Btw, light came in a silvered vacuum pack, with plastic case & foam insert separate. Little paper inside showed a check mark on “CREE”. But I ordered Nichia. Drop is now out of stock on this light. So looks like exchange won’t be possible.

O/T: Btw, something weird… “CVG Returns” in Hebron KY is the return address on package. A few days prior to my Drop order, I placed an order with Neal’s Gadgets for some FW3A parts. Well, guess what? Both packages arrived today. BOTH have the same return company/address! So what I’m guessing is that there’s some 3rd party shipping going on that pools overseas shipments that arrives in USA, to then send out at various intervals. And somehow my Neal’s Gadget order plus Drop order parts arrival coincided.

xevious
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I contacted support. Just like Christoph, I got a prompt reply from Brett. They still have stock, just not available for on-line purchase. So fingers crossed on making an exchange.

jon_slider
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xevious wrote:
Just got mine. Put battery in and nothing. On a lark, I looked at instructions. “Wait a few minutes for the capacitor in the tail switch to charge up.”

congrats
correct, the eSwitch has to charge up
that wont be an issue as long as you keep a battery in the light

….
meanwhile

My Cu Tool took 1 week to travel 10 miles, thanks to DHL

tracking:
—-
December 3, 2019, 11:54 am
Arrived MELROSE PARK, IL 60160 

November 26, 2019, 11:47 am
Arrived WOOD DALE, IL 60191 

—-

Im also having Slow Progress w DHL handling a package from Germany, 2 weeks to find its way to the Frankfurt airport and no updates from USPS yet.. poor me (first world problems.. lol)

—-

and
Update on my Brass Tool

I just got an email that my order was cancelled, refunded, and they gave me a $10 shopping credit..

phew.. I really did not want a Brass Tool.. sour grapes.. lol

so, I wrote back and asked if they will send me a Copper Tool instead Smile

stay tuned for the next exciting updates

xevious
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^ You can always make wine out of sour grapes. So… tart. Wink

Well, got an RMA label from Drop. Only pain is that I have to drop off at UPS, which is kind of out of my way. But I’m glad I’ll be able to get the Nichia version.

So, with a totally topped off Eneloop AAA battery, I pop it in. It works. But, can’t tell difference between medium & high. Low is certainly noticeable. But the other two are not. I don’t know if this light is defective or if this is normal behavior for rechargeable AAA. Will it take a 14500 10440?

argolite
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xevious wrote:
But, can’t tell difference between medium & high. Low is certainly noticeable. But the other two are not. I don’t know if this light is defective or if this is normal behavior for rechargeable AAA. Will it take a 14500?

I also thought there was little difference between M and H when my light was fresh, which is why I got out my lux meter. It was a bright day and I wasn’t willing to trust my eyes. I think my H got brighter over an hour or so as the light sat with a battery installed. It was sunset when I took the measurements in my earlier post. I wonder how long the tailcap would take to self-discharge so I can verify this.

Good luck cramming a 14500 in there Wink I assume you mean a 10440, which (we’re told) will make smoke.

xevious
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argolite wrote:
I also thought there was little difference between M and H when my light was fresh, which is why I got out my lux meter. It was a bright day and I wasn’t willing to trust my eyes. I think my H got brighter over an hour or so as the light sat with a battery installed. It was sunset when I took the measurements in my earlier post. I wonder how long the tailcap would take to self-discharge so I can verify this.

Good luck cramming a 14500 in there Wink I assume you mean a 10440, which (we’re told) will make smoke.

Yes, typo — corrected. In my case, I visually checked the beams in a lowly lit room. Can’t believe this is a 32 to 110 lumens difference. Checked again—definitely not. Could see maybe 20 lumens difference between medium & high. I won’t bother about it any longer since I’m sending the light back for an exchange.
jon_slider
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xevious wrote:
So, with a totally topped off Eneloop AAA battery, I pop it in. It works. But, can’t tell difference between medium & high.

you have to WAIT for the capacitor to charge up so it gives you the proper maximum mode.. give it at least 20 minutes.. better yet, give it an hour.. better yet, go to sleep, and in the morning all will be working (leave the battery IN the light)

if you use 10440 w eSwitch tools you only get maximum, until the battery drops to 3.8v and after that you will have 3 modes again…

but! 10440 is NOT recommended.. use at your own risk

xevious
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jon_slider wrote:
xevious wrote:
So, with a totally topped off Eneloop AAA battery, I pop it in. It works. But, can’t tell difference between medium & high.

you have to WAIT for the capacitor to charge up so it gives you the proper maximum mode.. give it at least 20 minutes.. better yet, give it an hour.. better yet, go to sleep, and in the morning all will be working (leave the battery IN the light)

if you use 10440 w eSwitch tools you only get maximum, until the battery drops to 3.8v and after that you will have 3 modes again…

but! 10440 is NOT recommended.. use at your own risk

Tell me Jon. What other flashlight do you know of that requires many minutes before its electronic switch capacitor “charges up” to full? I have 6 flashlights with electronic switches. None of them needs more than a few seconds of connectivity. Is there some kind of understood engineering principle at hand here? I’m really curious as to why the light was designed this way.
buck91
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My lumintop ti tool has the same switch I believe. First time I put batteries in it took a few minutes but since then it’s been perfect.

Muto
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xevious wrote:
argolite wrote:
I also thought there was little difference between M and H when my light was fresh, which is why I got out my lux meter. It was a bright day and I wasn’t willing to trust my eyes. I think my H got brighter over an hour or so as the light sat with a battery installed. It was sunset when I took the measurements in my earlier post. I wonder how long the tailcap would take to self-discharge so I can verify this.

Good luck cramming a 14500 in there Wink I assume you mean a 10440, which (we’re told) will make smoke.

Yes, typo — corrected. In my case, I visually checked the beams in a lowly lit room. Can’t believe this is a 32 to 110 lumens difference. Checked again—definitely not. Could see maybe 20 lumens difference between medium & high. I won’t bother about it any longer since I’m sending the light back for an exchange.

What happens when you pull the tailcap and use a wire to connect end of battery tube to battery negative?
If you still have hardly any difference between med and high then there may be something wrong with the driver, if it does show strong difference then the electronic switch is the culprit. At least you will know which is problem.

Mine acted somewhat same way till a Regular AAA primary reading 1.58v was inserted, then it charged up that tailcap real quick and we have been up and running just fine back on the Eneloops.
There probably is no stepup to switch voltage so you may need higher voltage one time to get it to spec.
Wish I had a Lithium AAA primary on hand to see how much brighter (if any) these lights get at 1.80 volts that these batteries usually start at when new.
HTH

Later,
Keith

After the Apocalypse there will be only 2 things left alive, Cockroaches and Keith Richards
..

Big Sky Country
..

No matter where you go, there you are.

jon_slider
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xevious wrote:
why…

I hope you get your curiosity satisfied.

Meanwhile, I hope you enjoy the light Smile

I just put my Cu Tool w sw45k LED mod on my light meter and it gives 2.3 lumens, 20 lumens, and 80 lumens. The difference is obvious. This particular head is actually a lego of a Maratac head (dont believe their ridiculous lumen claims). I get similar outputs from a Tool Head..

When I got my last 219c Cu Tool, the maximum was 110 lumens. Thats more lumens than the 219b that I prefer. The 219c is greener.

My Cu Tool always has a battery in it, as it is my most used aaa light. I dont have any mode issues.

And I like that the eSwitch allows tailstanding.

argolite
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xevious wrote:
I have 6 flashlights with electronic switches. None of them needs more than a few seconds of connectivity. Is there some kind of understood engineering principle at hand here? I’m really curious as to why the light was designed this way.

Also curious. I hope it translates to lower parasitic drain. My equipment lacks the sensitivity to measure anything.

I agree that tailstands help offset the extra clicks needed with this design.

WalkIntoTheLight
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jon_slider wrote:
you have to WAIT for the capacitor to charge up so it gives you the proper maximum mode.. give it at least 20 minutes.. better yet, give it an hour.. better yet, go to sleep, and in the morning all will be working (leave the battery IN the light)

That either doesn’t make sense, or that’s the dumbest flashlight design I’ve heard. An hour to charge up a capacitor so the light will work properly?

Even a camera flash only takes a few seconds to charge up a capacitor, and it’s using it as the main light source!

kat
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It’s probably a small li-ion battery, not a capacitor.

xevious
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Muto wrote:
What happens when you pull the tailcap and use a wirere may be something wrong with the driver, if it does show strong difference then the electronic switch is the culprit. At least you will ke to connect end of battery tube to battery negative?
If you still have hardly any difference between med and high then thnow which is problem.

Mine acted somewhat same way till a Regular AAA primary reading 1.58v was inserted, then it charged up that tailcap real quick and we have been up and running just fine back on the Eneloops.
There probably is no stepup to switch voltage so you may need higher voltage one time to get it to spec.
Wish I had a Lithium AAA primary on hand to see how much brighter (if any) these lights get at 1.80 volts that these batteries usually start at when new.
HTH

Later,
Keith

Great idea, Keith. I found a wire, stripped the ends, and completed the circuit. And YES… now it was clear to me the difference between medium & high. I noticed even medium is brighter without the tail cap. So apparently there must be some kind of current regulation going on in the tail cap and mine is faulty. I installed the tail cap after this test, and now I can’t even get mode changes working properly again. It’s either some sort of medium, then a medium-high, which starts out a little dim while switch is still depressed then brightens a little upon release of button. No low. Hopefully the replacement will be OK.
Yokiamy
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djozz wrote:
Anything from Drop (or anything from the US) goes via dutch customs (€18 extra minimum), so not worth it.

Useful info, thanx Djozz

  BLF

WalkIntoTheLight
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kat wrote:
It’s probably a small li-ion battery, not a capacitor.

Even dumber design, then. You have to charge a separate lithium-ion battery in the tailcap, every time you change the “main” battery? I don’t believe it.

I think they’re faulty units. The “charge the tailcap capacitor” is a dumb excuse.

xevious
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kat wrote:
It’s probably a small li-ion battery, not a capacitor.
WTH? Nobody makes a flashlight electronic switch like that. Why would they? A li-ion battery would eventually require replacement, having far less lifespan than a capacitor. And a tiny li-ion battery sandwiched inside a tail switch certainly wouldn’t be user serviceable.
argolite
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Here’s the abstract from Lumintop’s Energy storage type zero-power flashlight electronic switching circuit Chinese patent application:

Quote:
The utility model discloses an energy storage type zero -power flashlight electronic switching circuit, manage Q1, resistance R1 and electric capacity C1 including chip U1, battery U2, diode D1, MOS, 3 difference linked switch K1 of chip U1 pin, resistance R1 and electric capacity C1, chip U1 pin 6 and MOS pipe Q1’s the G utmost point is connected respectively to the resistance R1 other end, MOS pipe Q1’s D extremely distinguishes connecting resistance R3 and output B1, it is anodal that diode D1 is connected to the resistance R3 other end, chip U1 pin 5 is connected respectively to diode D1 negative pole, anodal and the diode D2 negative pole of battery U2, MOS pipe Q1’s the S utmost point is connected respectively to diode D2 positive pole, battery U2 negative pole, electric capacity C2, the output B2 and the electric capacity C1 other end. The utility model discloses a MOS control oil pipe heavy current, light in weight more small than ordinary mechanical switch, it is littleer than ordinary electronic switching circuit consumption, can reduce the standby electric current and adopt continuous electric energy storage type form for zero, these article, so do not worry live time and life.


See paragraphs [0011] to [0014] if you understand electronics and can get past the machine translation.

EDIT: added pic from T18 in the other thread. Note there’s one more component on the other side of the board (the MOS?) that matches what I can see at the base of the spring on my MassDrop light.

xevious
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^ What does this mean for the lay person who isn’t fluent in electronic circuit diagrams & components?

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Copper is out of stock now. They have a notice link, and appear to expect to have more eventually.

Quote:
We’ll send you an email once the product run starts.
jon_slider
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kat wrote:
It’s probably a small li-ion battery, not a capacitor.
it is actually a supercap http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1051700#comment-1051700
antiparanoico wrote:
It’s a good Seiko capacitor, not a battery. http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/925891#comment-925891

xevious wrote:
^ What does this mean for the lay person who isn’t fluent in electronic circuit diagrams & components?

It means the capacitor in the switch needs to charge up for the modes to work. Once the cap is full, all the modes will switch.

If the cap is not loaded, the vessel cant make the quantum leap into hyperspace Grad

argolite
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Thanks for the pointer. Here’s an interesting switch pic from that thread courtesy of T18 http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/925159#comment-925159
I see why it feels like the button is contacting the switch off center.


EDIT: I’ll add T18’s pic next to the schematic I extracted from the patent above for convenient comparison.

moderator007
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I just got my order for 10 Supercaps today from arrow electronics for building Loneoceans GFS16 FET switches. Ordered a few for spares.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/59550
The Seiko Supercaps are tiny and look just like a coin battery. Its only 4.8 mm in diameter.
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/xh414hg-iv01e/seiko-instruments-inc
It could be the same one used in these tool switches, I will check next time I take one apart.
.
Edit: From the pic in your link, it does look like the seiko XH414HG-IV01E.

kat
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if it’s a supercap then it should charge in seconds, not minutes

and something doesn’t make sense.
if it needs to be charged before use then it means there’s no battery inside?
and there was never a battery inside, no testing with a battery at all?
either that or the supercap lost it’s charge. so that means that thiswill just drain the battery all the time.
probably not a good idea to make switches like this

jon_slider
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kat wrote:
something doesn’t make sense.
It works even when you dont understand why.

try one sometime…

Here is my eSwitch Cu Tool running an MLH head from a Maratac, w sw45k LED swap

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