The lens doesn't mess it up very much even though I prefer to run it without. It isn't optimal, but it works. Several guys are still doing this.
Supfire A6, P60 hosts, and I'm sure many others. There was a thread somewhere on here specifically about hosts for quads.
A lens on top of the optics messes up what? I don’t have an optic based light that doesn’t have a lens over it! Am I missing something?
I put the lens on top to protect the more fragile polycarbonate optic material from scratches. They all work fine.
Richard, you're a Xtar dealer.
1. Why don't you sell Xtar flashlights? I plucked a few out of the 'bay, they seem well made for the price.
2. What is the correct pronunciation of 'Xtar'?
1. I don't think I can make any money selling them with the MAP requirements, and they aren't very popular.
2. 
I say it "ex-star", but who knows what the official pronunciation is?
Just got my own order today, thanks for the fast turnaround. Now we’ll see if I can solder a 7135…… We’ll see
1. How do MAP requirements affect modding? For example, model A has a MAP of $20 but you want to sell it for $$10. Could you sell it at $20 with one of those drop down menus to add ~$15 worth of mods for ~$5? If you catch my drift. Wink. Wink. Nudge. Nudge. 
2. Better find out before your 'Dealer of the Month' award's luncheon with the CEO. 
Good luck! Hope you bought extras.
Right you are Richard. More than one excellent US vendor has bent over backwards and tried to negotiate with Xtar in order to attempt selling and servicing its flashlights. While their flagship lights (S1 and D26) were once worthy contenders in their price range, Xtars pig-headed sales tactics, min order requirements, MAP, no price reductions and return policies made selling their products a huge nonprofit/high liability proposition for its vendors. They also continued to package old generation emitters in brand new +$350 dollar lights. :Sp Avoid these imbeciles and save yourself a great deal of lost sleep and major headaches.
I can do whatever I want with the light as long as it sells for MAP. That said, I don't think that any of their lights are worth the trouble/effort to mod. Starting with a fresh host is easier and less time consuming than taking apart an existing light--especially with lights like this where a lot of the parts aren't standard sizes. If I thought it would offer a big benefit over any of the existing hosts I would do it, but I just don't see that benefit.
That pretty much sums it up. I looked at what my cost would be, then looked at what others were selling them for and how many. Most dealers that have them have just been sitting on them...for a long time, with very few sales. The lights are overpriced and don't offer any real advantages compared to the competition. Even their flagship diving light is just sitting on vendor's shelfs.
I don't think they understand American business. Dealership restrictions with MAP, minimum order quotas, etc., make some sense in certain retail situations--but not with a small line of battery chargers! There is a reason they exist with automobiles, motorcycles, etc.: each dealership invests a substantial amount of money procuring a location, securing a lease or building a facility, training staff, receiving certifications for mechanics, etc. Those dealerships have a lot of risk and long-term liability involved, so it may be in the best interest of that dealership to have some MAP requirements, territory limitations, etc. But with flashlight parts that you can sell online and anyone with enough money can buy into this should not be the case and I would argue that there is no reason for MAP to exist.
XTAR offers some nice chargers, which is why I carry them, but their lights just aren't that interesting. I think that some of their chargers are overpriced for what they offer (VP4 at $39), which is why I give away batteries with those chargers. Some of the ones I used to give batteries away with now have a lower MAP or no MAP so I don't have to do that anymore on those models.
I hate to post this, but I am getting more and more threatening messages like this every day:
Besides the obvious misunderstanding about cell protection, did they not look at the item pictures?
Going to guess he ^ has been told to watch out for batteries mis-labeled but doesn’t realize/understand you just wrapped/protected them. Maybe if you switch to clear wrapping like Wallbuys did it will prevent that.
I get that in a general sense, but this is what you see on the website:
Do you see any green here?
If this person is blind I will apologize, but if you're not blind to claim a bait and switch is pretty strong (basically accusing me of fraud), and to not have seen that the batteries aren't green on the outside is ridiculous.
I took a while to sort it out because I was sure I’d gotten the box with the cells I ordered — I’d ordered by the name, knowing exactly which cells I wanted, so hadn’t paid attention to the picture. (that was an order last month, I think — I’ve ordered more of the same cells in the past couple of days)
I got the box, it had a replacement Xtar in it that took all my attention — then life interfered for a while, stuff happened, and by the time I went looking for the Panasonics, I’d forgotten how they looked.
Adding a bit to the confusion, the cells I got fairly recently are close to what’s pictured but not quite the same — slightly different wrapper, the placement of some text and icons are slightly different from what’s in your catalog. (Take a look at your stock and compare, pm me if you dont’ see a difference)
So I was staring at what I had in my hand, comparing it to what’s in the catalog, noticing they were slightly different, and needed a clue.
You know how this goes, when someone’s lacking a clue, everything looks like it might be a clue — most of what i saw just confused me.
Since the picture in the catalog doesn’t show the “EVV” that’s prominent when holding the cells in hand, it took me some looking and thinking before I figured out that these EVV cells must be the Panasonic cells I’d bought.
Actually, while I”m not blind, I’m getting old enough that vision is tricky. So while I’m not that guy who got upset — and I’m not upset at all — I’m just saying — well, you don’t know how blind other people can be until stuff starts to happen to you.
I haven’t looked hard at the other cells I bought that are Sanyos, also in EVV wrappers, to see if they’re exactly like the catalog or not.
The button top insulator changes from batch to batch (sometimes white, sometimes black) and the text has changed slightly several times. Not enough to be worth the effort of taking new pictures every time I receive a new batch.
We're talking about the difference between a green cell and a black cell though--not minor variations in text or other features.
I think it’s important to maintain the proper terminology. The customer accused you of selling one thing and shipping another, I guess that may normally be referred to as “product substitution.” [EDIT: which is fraud of course.] Unfortunately they went on to labeled that practice “bait and switch.” That is not a correct use of the term, a bait-and-switch is a different type of scam.
In a bait-and-switch scam an attractive thing is advertised. When the customer attempts to purchase this thing they are then informed that the advertised thing is not available and advised to switch to some other product which allows for a larger profit.
I’m sure it doesn’t really matter very much to the customer, who seems to be confused, but I just wanted to make the terminology clear here.
What did you mean when you said “Besides the obvious misunderstanding about cell protection”? I have an inkling, but your post doesn’t make it clear. If you’re referring to the misunderstanding that I think you are then it doesn’t seem fair to get upset about the rest!
Yeah, I understand — just saying, the same cells confused me for a while. I’m the kind who makes every effort to figure stuff out myself first.
The person who got upset didn’t take time to think, and there are those “I’m confused, someone must be to blame! …” folks out there.
Since you say you’re getting more of that sort of thing, I’d guess you’re getting a wider range of people as you get more customers — so there will be a few more each day who are further out on the ‘tail’ of the distribution for ‘understanding what they’re getting’. A few more smarter modders, a few more clueless ….
For what it’s worth, I paid no attention at all to the picture when I ordered Panasonics, I went entirely by the text — I did a text search, found exactly the item I wanted, and I made the order.
Then confused myself because I didn’t check those when the box came in, because i was checking that Xtar cell replacement — such distraction happens).
I’d have been puzzled even if I had immediately opened the box and looked at the cells — because I’d ordered by name. So I’d have done the same thing, go look at the page, expand the picture, peer at the cells, peer at the picture — even if I’d had the invoice in hand and the box delivered immediately. I’d have figured it out — but that would’ve been the first time I’d paid attention to your picture, so — puzzlement was inevitable.
I guess I’ve gotten used to pictures being wrong on the Internet, and still trust text. I’ve gotten other surprises.
Well, you can’t help when people skip over the pictures entirely. It sounds like you need to add some information on your listings for people who are less familiar with protected batteries. Spell out that panasonic does not sell cells with protection already added. Instead it must be added by companies like Evva, keeppower and others. In order to hold the protection securely it needs to be shrinkwrapped over the protection & the original wrappers are removed to keep from adding thickness (double shrinkwrap can cause fitment issues in some lights).
I’d suggest a few changes for typos and a few changed words — as I changed what’s above in that no-longer-exactly-quote.
I second the recommendation, that’s important information.
I for one couldn’t have written that for you.
So I’ll just applaud Halo’s writing.
It did need rewording. 