TK75 vs BTU Shocker - Let the battle begin! (NEW UPDATE ON POST 125)

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rdrfronty
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It is logical for Fenix to run a LED slightly over the 3amp for turbo modes. A XML driven at 3.5a or even more is very safe if it has any heat sinking at all. Also there has been many reports that TK70 are actually in the 2500-2600otf range. I have never tested one so I cannot say yeah or neah on that.
As for my numbers, I know my lightbox reads true for lights up to 2500 otf. I have tested multiple of them, such as two SRK’s. One tests out as 2180otf and one tests out at 2200otf, both pretty much what everybody expects them to put out. I have even sent lights to other members to verify my numbers. And we have always been with in a few percent of each other.
I haven’t tested anything over 2500 lumens before these two lights, but there is no logical reason to think my numbers would get off by 3-400 lumens when testing lights just slightly more powerful the Kings. Sure I could be off a few percent, my lightbox and meter setup is good, but not perfect. But it’s not 300 lumens off.
The Fenix TK75 is driven over 3 amps on turbo. I have no doubt.

DENGOH
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rdrfronty wrote:
It is logical for Fenix to run a LED slightly over the 3amp for turbo modes. A XML driven at 3.5a or even more is very safe if it has any heat sinking at all. Also there has been many reports that TK70 are actually in the 2500-2600otf range. I have never tested one so I cannot say yeah or neah on that. As for my numbers, I know my lightbox reads true for lights up to 2500 otf. I have tested multiple of them, such as two SRK’s. One tests out as 2180otf and one tests out at 2200otf, both pretty much what everybody expects them to put out. I have even sent lights to other members to verify my numbers. And we have always been with in a few percent of each other. I haven’t tested anything over 2500 lumens before these two lights, but there is no logical reason to think my numbers would get off by 3-400 lumens when testing lights just slightly more powerful the Kings. Sure I could be off a few percent, my lightbox and meter setup is good, but not perfect. But it’s not 300 lumens off. The Fenix TK75 is driven over 3 amps on turbo. I have no doubt.

3.5A will be way over 30W. Maybe Fenix manage to break law of physics.

cool i'll see you when you get there

Dale
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DENGOH wrote:
rdrfronty wrote:
It is logical for Fenix to run a LED slightly over the 3amp for turbo modes. A XML driven at 3.5a or even more is very safe if it has any heat sinking at all. Also there has been many reports that TK70 are actually in the 2500-2600otf range. I have never tested one so I cannot say yeah or neah on that. As for my numbers, I know my lightbox reads true for lights up to 2500 otf. I have tested multiple of them, such as two SRK’s. One tests out as 2180otf and one tests out at 2200otf, both pretty much what everybody expects them to put out. I have even sent lights to other members to verify my numbers. And we have always been with in a few percent of each other. I haven’t tested anything over 2500 lumens before these two lights, but there is no logical reason to think my numbers would get off by 3-400 lumens when testing lights just slightly more powerful the Kings. Sure I could be off a few percent, my lightbox and meter setup is good, but not perfect. But it’s not 300 lumens off. The Fenix TK75 is driven over 3 amps on turbo. I have no doubt.

3.5A will be way over 30W. Maybe Fenix manage to break law of physics.

Not sure if we are talking bout the same thing… My Btu on turbo

DENGOH
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Dale, It is same thing if your picture is about current flow into led. If yes, BTU is indeed driven to 3.8A according to your picture. The issue is BTU is not performing as it should be. It is just shortening led and battery life in turbo mode with high current consumption if compare to Fenix TK75.

TK75 is not driven above 3A according to Fenix runtime and also wattage measurement I attached below. At 7.5V, total wattage is about 30W.
If TK75 is driven to 3.5A per led according to rdrfronty, it will be about 12W per LED, and it will be 36W for 3 LED alone. If we add in efficiency into calculation, it will be about 38-40W. If only Fenix manage to get the extra 10W out of thin air since they manage to break laws of physics.

cool i'll see you when you get there

DENGOH
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Don’t mean to trash BTU, by itself it is very good flashlight if not looking at the lens, reflector and battery carrier. Problem is relatively TK75 is too good until rdrfronty think it is driven to 3.5-3.8A. Which is not true.

cool i'll see you when you get there

rdrfronty
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According to reviews I’ve seen, the TK75 puts out 41wt. And where are you getting 7.5V? The voltage is 8.4, not 7.5V.

rdrfronty
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DENGOH wrote:
Don’t mean to trash BTU, by itself it is very good flashlight if not looking at the lens, reflector and battery carrier. Problem is relatively TK75 is too good until rdrfronty think it is driven to 3.5-3.8A. Which is not true.

The TK75 is driven at a minimum of 3.5a on turbo. Also the photo of dales BTU has been ramped up slightly. Stock is closer to 3.8 vs his 3.9+ amps.
The BTU is running just as efficient as the TK75 give or take a couple percent.
DENGOH
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Just look at the graph I posted. Voltage at 7.5V, current is about 4.05A. It is 30W.
Can you post the link of the review? Wish to see which genius did that review.

cool i'll see you when you get there

rdrfronty
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Yes I can. And it’s not 7.5v. I don’t know where you come with a voltage like that with 4.2v batteries. You can only have 4.2, 8.4, 12.6, and 16.8v. And with its configuration, the voltage is 8.4.

http://reviewsdelinternas.blogspot.com.es/2012/12/fenix-tk75.html?m=1

DENGOH
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rdrfronty wrote:
DENGOH wrote:
Don’t mean to trash BTU, by itself it is very good flashlight if not looking at the lens, reflector and battery carrier. Problem is relatively TK75 is too good until rdrfronty think it is driven to 3.5-3.8A. Which is not true.

The TK75 is driven at a minimum of 3.5a on turbo. Also the photo of dales BTU has been ramped up slightly. Stock is closer to 3.8 vs his 3.9+ amps.
The BTU is running just as efficient as the TK75 give or take a couple percent.

Good that you are standing firm to what you believe in.

cool i'll see you when you get there

rdrfronty
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Well, heck. Your graph you posted shows I’m right. It shows peak voltage at 8.4. And it shows the amps at 3.5a per emitter.

Dale
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I love my BTU. Wouldnt trade it. I see a few areas where there could be a bit of improvement. To be honest there are no perfect lights. Lest we would all only own one. I will say this. My BTU with the XML 2 U2 with the driver boosted a bit. Is a world of difference from the CW’s it came with. I like to poke fun a the TK75 users. But the TK is a excellent light as well… Now the technical aspects I leave to you fine people.

DENGOH
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rdrfronty wrote:
Yes I can. And it’s not 7.5v. I don’t know where you come with a voltage like that with 4.2v batteries. You can only have 4.2, 8.4, 12.6, and 16.8v. And with its configuration, the voltage is 8.4.

http://reviewsdelinternas.blogspot.com.es/2012/12/fenix-tk75.html?m=1

That reviewer made a very big mistake not taking battery voltage sag into his calculation.
He measure tail cap current of 4.9A, and he assume voltage of 8.4V, and get a 41.16Watt. This is completely not true as it won’t be 8.4V.
Since he made such a mistake, I doubt his measurement of 4.9A either as high current measurement is not as simple as it looks.
When it comes to wattage measurement, you better believe in power supply that has +/-sense connection. Wattage measurement using batteries has too much variable in it depending on your batteries condition and cables.

cool i'll see you when you get there

DENGOH
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rdrfronty wrote:
Well, heck. Your graph you posted shows I’m right. It shows peak voltage at 8.4. And it shows the amps at 3.5a per emitter.

That is volt-current graph of whole torch. Not the led alone. No one can put 8.4V between led and not burning it.

cool i'll see you when you get there

rdrfronty
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I don’t know what goes to the emitter on the TK nor do you. And I don’t know what goes to the emitter iphone the BTU. I just know you don’t get 975otf with a XML U2 driven under 3a. Find me ANY example of this – I dare you.

rdrfronty
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I tell you what. Lets just call a truce on this thing. Your not going to convince me that the TK75 is driven less than 3A. And I’m not going to convince you it is driven a minimum of 3.5A. You like the TK75. I like the BTU and the TK75.
So lets give this little tit for tat up. Deal :quest: :quest: :quest:

DENGOH
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rdrfronty wrote:
I don’t know what goes to the emitter on the TK nor do you. And I don’t know what goes to the emitter iphone the BTU. I just know you don’t get 975otf with a XML U2 driven under 3a. Find me ANY example of this – I dare you.

TK75, if your 975otf is real.

Why so insist until spreading wrong information about TK75, of course mostly it is that reviewer misled you. It can jeopardize TK75 if others think that it is driven to 3.5-3.8A per led. Not everyone like such configuration as it will harm LED. Of course, some people here would love to see Fenix drive TK75 harder.

cool i'll see you when you get there

DENGOH
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rdrfronty wrote:
I tell you what. Lets just call a truce on this thing. Your not going to convince me that the TK75 is driven less than 3A. And I’m not going to convince you it is driven a minimum of 3.5A. You like the TK75. I like the BTU and the TK75. So lets give this little tit for tat up. Deal :quest: :quest: :quest:

No, I won’t make a deal with you as it is not right. For god sake, I just taught you how to read volt-current graph without trashing your many years of experience testing flashlight. Wake up!

cool i'll see you when you get there

rdrfronty
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I can promise you if anything, this thread has helped TK75 sales. I wouldn’t want one only driven at 3A. I would actually prefer 4.2A.
And NO mis-information was put out by me on the TK75. I get my data scientifically. No guess work.
Anyway, read my previous. Lets stop this crap. It’s not helping either the BTU, the TK75, You, or me.
We are at an impasse. Truce?

Dale
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I LOVE YOU GUYS!!!!

ILIKEFLASHLIGHTS
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Well one thing we can agree on is the TK75 will hold its sale value a lot better than the BTU Shocker.

rdrfronty
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This is my last statement on this thread. Period.
You are wrong. You proved yourself wrong on your previous graph. The TK75 is driven at 3.5a at minimum. The lumens prove it even more so.
You keep bickering with yourself. I’m done.

Streamer
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I think Jesus has a TK75…I’ll ask him.

wellllll…i asked…. and his response was” “I’M not tellin’” 0:)

DENGOH
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I am done either. Else things get out of hand when getting emotional.
Thanks to your testing and reporting here. As I’ve said before, not many are willing to test and report.

cool i'll see you when you get there

manxbuggy1
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Dale wrote:
I love my BTU. Wouldnt trade it. I see a few areas where there could be a bit of improvement. To be honest there are no perfect lights. Lest we would all only own one. I will say this. My BTU with the XML 2 U2 with the driver boosted a bit. Is a world of difference from the CW’s it came with. I like to poke fun a the TK75 users. But the TK is a excellent light as well… Now the technical aspects I leave to you fine people.

I am with you Dale! I don’t even really understand the graph. All I know is I love my TK75 and like you wouldn’t trade it for anything. On the other hand I think rdr’s BTU is also an awesome light and do not understand people saying it is not living up to the hype. What kind of numbers does this light have to put out before it wins the respect of the community. Those who own it know it is a hard performing beast but yet a lot still think it is an under achiever. I think both lights are great. It really doesn’t mean anything to me which light is considered better. In our tests the TK75 won one contest ( lumens ) and the BTU won the other ( throw ). I would say that it is a draw!
manxbuggy1
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Sorry guys . Not trying to drag this on. I am a slow typer. Ya’ll posted 10 posts while I was typing it out. Lol.

C-channel
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One more test to go for the final battle. SC600 vs TF50 style. Ha.

How bright is bright enough...

Runtime VS Lumens...

manxbuggy1
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Sorry but we don’t own either one of those. I do have the small sun zy-t29 which is a far more budget offering along those lines and I doubt would compete with either.

Shaquille
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MattSPL wrote:
Was there an optional driver for the BTU? Or is this it with the high power driver installed?

yes ,the DRY DRIVER should help put more out of the big mouthed BTU

I ordered it more then a week ago and it hasnt been shipped yet!  CN quality goods customer service is terrible these days

 

GottaZoom
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Someone read it on the internet. It must be true. Wink

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