The 219C D4S does exactly what is specified. I got 2930 lumens at turn on (actually at ~2 sec taking into consideration the measurement time). This was with an iJoy 4200 mAh 26650.
My D4 actually does a bit more than that at 3170 lumens with a VTC5A, but it’s the earlier CRI80 version with the more powerful driver. It also steps down after ten seconds while the D4S is still at 2430 lumen at 30 seconds.
Magical lights like these are more show pieces for me and my friends. I can look in the closet with anything. I am almost reluctant to use my showcase lights for fear of damaging them by either a clumsy drop, banging it on something or rattling my keys against it all day.
Mostly I just appreciate all the options and the complicated UI for the craftiness of the programmer and the effort it took to make it work well.
I know the feeling. When trying to break out of my routine I’ll almost grab a light and think “It’s too nice to take to work!” I work in a greasy, oily, swarfy environment.
Trying to master flashing so I can put TK firmware in ALL my lights (where possible).
Thank you.. i spent 5 minutes trying to switch to smooth ramping.. i was doing three fast click and hold from off..
I’m curious what people think of the method used for smooth and stepped ramps, and switching between them. Do you use just one, or both? If just one, which? What configurations do you use, and why?
Stepped ramps mode is a nice feature to have.. now i know stepped and smooth modes are interchangeable by three fast clicks.
Smooth Ramping modes is for around the house.
Stepped modes for outdoor.
Emisar is ahead of their game. One of my favorite feature is magnetic tailcap..
I’ve just tried the stepped ramps and will probably stick to that. Feels awesome and I love that you can choose the number of steps.
And the fact that the light always (after a moment of not clicking anything) ramps up by default and you can just go down with a double click and hold is great. Even though this causes the 0.5s delay before the light shuts off after clicking. I can live with that since the reversing is too handy!
I’m not a fan of the Zebralightesque “accidentally went too high from off” syndrome. With the D4 there was a small delay when you held the switch down from off. The light turned to moon and you could release. On the D4S you’ll accidentally activate the memorized mode if you release the switch too soon. This can happen easily since the light turns on moon immediately when the switch is pressed. You have to time it correctly. Also the moon always coming on first when clicking the light on feels weird.
Ok. After playing with the light, I like stepped mode ramp better.. it’s so cool. Turbo mode can be activated by double click.. I am going to stick with stepped mode..
I can also attach my magnetic tailcap to the garage when I am working on the car.. no more rolling!
Thank you.. i spent 5 minutes trying to switch to smooth ramping.. i was doing three fast click and hold from off..
I’m curious what people think of the method used for smooth and stepped ramps, and switching between them. Do you use just one, or both? If just one, which? What configurations do you use, and why?
Stepped ramps mode is a nice feature to have.. now i know stepped and smooth modes are interchangeable by three fast clicks.
Smooth Ramping modes is for around the house.
Stepped modes for outdoor.
Emisar is ahead of their game. One of my favorite feature is magnetic tailcap..
I think it’s the best stock Hot Rod light I ever purchased for the money. I can’t seem to stop playing with it or having it out of reach for some reason, Crazy huh?
Fits in one of my holsters well, but I don’t want to take a chance on scratching it. Heck I’m not even going to mess with it and bypass the springs, it’s that remarkable to me!
TK/Hank you hit this one is out of the park, outstanding job! Thank you!
After playing with the light, I like stepped mode ramp better..
maukka wrote:
I’ve just tried the stepped ramps and will probably stick to that. Feels awesome and I love that you can choose the number of steps.
And the fact that the light always (after a moment of not clicking anything) ramps up by default and you can just go down with a double click and hold is great. Even though this causes the 0.5s delay before the light shuts off after clicking. I can live with that since the reversing is too handy!
I’m glad to hear people like most of the new stuff. I haven’t gotten much feedback about the stepped ramp yet.
maukka wrote:
I’m not a fan of the Zebralightesque “accidentally went too high from off” syndrome. With the D4 there was a small delay when you held the switch down from off. The light turned to moon and you could release. On the D4S you’ll accidentally activate the memorized mode if you release the switch too soon. This can happen easily since the light turns on moon immediately when the switch is pressed. You have to time it correctly. Also the moon always coming on first when clicking the light on feels weird.
This is the first negative feedback I’ve heard about the instant moon feature. If you’d like to disable that, comment out this part of the code:
// hold (initially): go to lowest level, but allow abort for regular click
else if (event == EV_click1_press) {
set_level(nearest_level(1));
return MISCHIEF_MANAGED;
}
So, everyone, what do you prefer?
A. Activate the lowest level immediately when the button is pressed. Provides a hint that “click” and “hold” do different things, but requires the user to time the button release without direct feedback. (RampingIOS V3, Anduril)
B. Don’t respond when the button is pressed. Takes longer to get any light, but makes moon timing easier. (RampingIOS V2, NarsilM)
Basically, what do you prefer for step 1 here?
At button press…
A. … turn on at the lowest level.
B. … do nothing. Stay off.
If user releases button quickly, go to memorized level.
If user holds the button for 0.4s, lock in the lowest level. User can release the button at this point to stay at the lowest level, or keep holding to ramp up.
Happily, just pulled the trigger on 2 D4S, grey 219C and Green XPL HI 5000K NW from MTN.
I was considering the XPG2 5700K version, but budgetary limits kick in. Would anyone help describe the differences between the XPL HI NW and the XPG2 S4 2B: tint artifacts, throw and output differences, runtime?
Any and all opinions and recommendations are welcome, as I am a long time CW bias recently converted to NW and high CRI, seeking the knowledge of others with experience.
Also, decided on the Shockli 5500 mAh cells, any other recommendations?
Is there a way to calculate lumen for the stepped ramp?
With the known max output, no. of steps, steps for top and bottom ceiling?
I think of a spreadsheet, you type the values in and get the lumens for each step.
Is there a way to calculate lumen for the stepped ramp?
With the known max output, no. of steps, steps for top and bottom ceiling?
I think of a spreadsheet, you type the values in and get the lumens for each step.
Ish.
It’s hard to do because of how different LEDs have different lumen levels, and in the FET modes, it also depends a lot on battery type and voltage.
Aside from that though, basically you’d have to look up the PWM values from the firmware’s ramp table, calculate the power level, then look up that power level on an emitter test graph.
Or try the bin/level_calc.py tool, which produces a relatively naive estimate of how many lumens it expects. These numbers may not match actual measurements though, because it doesn’t know the emitter’s response curve and may have been given intentionally wrong values in order to force the graph into a particular shape. Like, for the D4S, I told the calculator the lowest level was 11.2 lm and the highest was 4000 lm, and that it should use a ninth-root curve shape, because this got the values to line up how I wanted. But in reality it’s more like 0.3 lm to 5000 lm.
I am using shockli imr on my d4s.. it performs great..
I did some research on 26650 high drain batteries not long ago:
JasonWW wrote:
Here is another question I was trying to figure out. We know a single 70.2 can pull upwards of 18 amps from a pair of 26650, but what kind of limits would we see trying to power 3 of those emitters?
I looked at the tried and true cyan Liitokala 5000mah (2016), but I don’t think they sell those anymore. The black version is still sold and looks like a good performer. 20A continous and 30A pulse.
The Shockli 5500mah black is a newer battery (2017) and it looks like it is a step up. It’s still 20A continous and 30A pulse. Compared to the Liitokala black it has about 0.10 volt less sag at 20A and about 0.15 volt less sag at 30A.
I’m just learning there is a new Shockli 4300mah (2018) light green that looks aimed at even higher drain use. It is 30A continous and 40A pulse. Compared to the Liitokala black it has about 0.13 volt less sag at 20A and about 0.2 to 0.25 volt less sag at 30A. That’s a huge improvement. This looks to be the cell to use for highest performance.
If anyone has heard of any other new 26650 high drains, let me know.
Edit: It looks like the Ijoy INR26650 4200mAh (Black-Yellow) is a match for it.
The highest drain 26650 might be the Golisi IMR26650 4300mAh (Gold) at 35A continous. Wow.
The Golisi blows away the Shockli 5500mah and Liitokala 5000mah black.
Note: This is all data from HKJ.
how about the black Basen with gold writing…it has 60a pulse
I have an authentic basen 5000mah with 50/60a pulse. there’s also the basen 4500mah with 40/60a pulse. have you checked those? I don’t have your set up to check the specs in the light itself. I almost bought the 4500 but it doesn’t have Basen written 4 times on the top of the battery like my other one does
I have an authentic basen 5000mah with 50/60a pulse. there’s also the basen 4500mah with 40/60a pulse. have you checked those? I don’t have your set up to check the specs in the light itself. I almost bought the 4500 but it doesn’t have Basen written 4 times on the top of the battery like my other one does
I’m not a fan of the Zebralightesque “accidentally went too high from off” syndrome. With the D4 there was a small delay when you held the switch down off. The light turned to moon and you could release. On the D4S you’ll accidentally activate the memorized mode if you release the switch too soon. This can happen easily since the light turns on moon immediately when the switch is pressed. You have to time it correctly. Also the moon always coming on first when clicking the light on feels weird.
ToyKeeper wrote:
I’m glad to hear people like most of the new stuff. I haven’t gotten much feedback about the stepped ramp yet.
If user holds the button for 0.4s, lock in the lowest level. User can release the button at this point to stay at the lowest level, or keep holding to ramp up.
At first I blinded myself a few times with this feature as well. And I couldn’t figure out what I was doing, or doing wrong anyway.
But after figuring it out, I’m happy with the way it functions. I do have to click and hold longer than expected, but there’s sufficient delaying before ramping up off moon to land in that I’m no longer bothered by it.
I’m still not ever sure what I’m going to get for a double click from off – last used mode, some random mode, or turbo. I’m aiming for turbo, but I’m not sure I always get it. And speaking of double click, the thermal reduction is so smooth you don’t notice it, so if you double click to turbo, and the light backs off a smidgen due to throttling, and you double click again, basically nothing happens cause you go back to turbo.
Since I just ordered my green D4S from Richard yesterday and I don’t actually have one yet, I built another one. This time in solid copper.
I made a Te/Cu head surrounding the Noctigon 33mm Quad MCPCB with Angie optic and mated it to the full copper body of an 18650 Sinner light. Not having my springs yet from Blue, I’m making do with the “measely” 5685 lumens out the front provided by an Sony VTC5A 18650. (output courtesy of 4 Samsung LH351D 5000K 80 CRI emitters)
What happens if change the stepped ramps to like just 2 steps? Does it just split the output in half?
Since the floor, ceiling, and number of steps can be whatever you want, it spaces the middle modes evenly on a visually-linear scale. Or as close as it can get, at least, from the 150 available levels.
With just 2 steps, you’ll get just the floor and the ceiling. Nothing between. Modes are low, high, and maybe turbo.
I say “maybe turbo” because it depends on where the ceiling is configured. If the ceiling is set to 150 (one click), there is no separate turbo.
With 3 steps, it’ll be floor, ceiling, and halfway between on the ramp. So it’d do low, med, high, and maybe turbo.
Or to set it up for steps of 25, 50, 75, 100, 125, and 150… Do 25 clicks for floor, 26 clicks for ceiling, and 5 steps. Five regular output levels plus turbo.
If you tell it to use just 1 step, it’ll get a little confused and act like you configured it for 2 steps instead. But you can still make it a one-mode light by setting the floor and ceiling to the same number, I think. Unless it divides by zero. That’s a possibility. Probably should have tested that.
For use as a 1-mode light, I’d recommend just using momentary/tactical mode.
I meant in post 493, the middle light. In reference to the basen, someone gave it to me but the ones I’ve been seeing don’t seem legit. Liion wholesalers has the 4500mah basen in stock
The 219C D4S does exactly what is specified. I got 2930 lumens at turn on (actually at ~2 sec taking into consideration the measurement time). This was with an iJoy 4200 mAh 26650.
My D4 actually does a bit more than that at 3170 lumens with a VTC5A, but it’s the earlier CRI80 version with the more powerful driver. It also steps down after ten seconds while the D4S is still at 2430 lumen at 30 seconds.
Thanks for sharing these figures. I am probably going to draw fire from saying this. TBH, I am a bit underwhelmed and disappointed that the lumen outputs will drop below 1000 lumens in less than 2 minute? Is this behavior due to timed stepdown? Since this flashlight has more mass compared to the D4, which should help it to dissipate heat better, I was hoping it should be able to output half the max lumens for sustained period.
Are the figures similar for the other LEDs: XP-G2 S4 and XP-L HI ?
The 219C D4S does exactly what is specified. I got 2930 lumens at turn on (actually at ~2 sec taking into consideration the measurement time). This was with an iJoy 4200 mAh 26650.
My D4 actually does a bit more than that at 3170 lumens with a VTC5A, but it’s the earlier CRI80 version with the more powerful driver. It also steps down after ten seconds while the D4S is still at 2430 lumen at 30 seconds.
D4S
0:00 2930 lm
0:30 2430 lm
1:00 1800 lm
1:30 1253 lm
2:00 979 lm
2:30 836 lm
3:00 808 lm
Would someone measure max regulated (7135) output for both xpl hi and 219c versions?
Please and thank you!
I know the feeling. When trying to break out of my routine I’ll almost grab a light and think “It’s too nice to take to work!” I work in a greasy, oily, swarfy environment.
Trying to master flashing so I can put TK firmware in ALL my lights (where possible).
Per Mooch, as of April 11, 2018, iJOY, Golisi, Vapecell, and Aspire all use the same cell under the wrap ~30A-32A/4200mAh-4300mAh.
The red/black Shockli 5500mAh was estimated at 20A.
Stepped ramps mode is a nice feature to have.. now i know stepped and smooth modes are interchangeable by three fast clicks.
Smooth Ramping modes is for around the house.
Stepped modes for outdoor.
Emisar is ahead of their game. One of my favorite feature is magnetic tailcap..
I’ve just tried the stepped ramps and will probably stick to that. Feels awesome and I love that you can choose the number of steps.
And the fact that the light always (after a moment of not clicking anything) ramps up by default and you can just go down with a double click and hold is great. Even though this causes the 0.5s delay before the light shuts off after clicking. I can live with that since the reversing is too handy!
I’m not a fan of the Zebralightesque “accidentally went too high from off” syndrome. With the D4 there was a small delay when you held the switch down from off. The light turned to moon and you could release. On the D4S you’ll accidentally activate the memorized mode if you release the switch too soon. This can happen easily since the light turns on moon immediately when the switch is pressed. You have to time it correctly. Also the moon always coming on first when clicking the light on feels weird.
Ok. After playing with the light, I like stepped mode ramp better.. it’s so cool. Turbo mode can be activated by double click.. I am going to stick with stepped mode..
I can also attach my magnetic tailcap to the garage when I am working on the car.. no more rolling!
I think it’s the best stock Hot Rod light I ever purchased for the money. I can’t seem to stop playing with it or having it out of reach for some reason, Crazy huh? Fits in one of my holsters well, but I don’t want to take a chance on scratching it. Heck I’m not even going to mess with it and bypass the springs, it’s that remarkable to me! TK/Hank you hit this one is out of the park, outstanding job!
KB1428 “Live Life WOT”
I ordered from Intl-Outdoor, and my green, 219c, D4S arrived at my house (in Seattle) today. Now to learn the UI a bit.
It’s hard to appreciate brightness, since I’m sitting outside on a clear day, but it’s definitely bright, and hot.
Very nice.. I like stepped mode and the mode will go to high max ( 50 % ), unless you double click..
I’m glad to hear people like most of the new stuff. I haven’t gotten much feedback about the stepped ramp yet.
This is the first negative feedback I’ve heard about the instant moon feature. If you’d like to disable that, comment out this part of the code:
// hold (initially): go to lowest level, but allow abort for regular click else if (event == EV_click1_press) { set_level(nearest_level(1)); return MISCHIEF_MANAGED; }So, everyone, what do you prefer?
Basically, what do you prefer for step 1 here?
Hello!
Happily, just pulled the trigger on 2 D4S, grey 219C and Green XPL HI 5000K NW from MTN.
I was considering the XPG2 5700K version, but budgetary limits kick in. Would anyone help describe the differences between the XPL HI NW and the XPG2 S4 2B: tint artifacts, throw and output differences, runtime?
Any and all opinions and recommendations are welcome, as I am a long time CW bias recently converted to NW and high CRI, seeking the knowledge of others with experience.
Also, decided on the Shockli 5500 mAh cells, any other recommendations?
Many thanks in advance for your input !
Shockli is the best 26650 I can find..
I have no D4S, but from the reading I tend to B.
Is there a way to calculate lumen for the stepped ramp?
With the known max output, no. of steps, steps for top and bottom ceiling?
I think of a spreadsheet, you type the values in and get the lumens for each step.
Ish.
It’s hard to do because of how different LEDs have different lumen levels, and in the FET modes, it also depends a lot on battery type and voltage.
Aside from that though, basically you’d have to look up the PWM values from the firmware’s ramp table, calculate the power level, then look up that power level on an emitter test graph.
Or try the bin/level_calc.py tool, which produces a relatively naive estimate of how many lumens it expects. These numbers may not match actual measurements though, because it doesn’t know the emitter’s response curve and may have been given intentionally wrong values in order to force the graph into a particular shape. Like, for the D4S, I told the calculator the lowest level was 11.2 lm and the highest was 4000 lm, and that it should use a ninth-root curve shape, because this got the values to line up how I wanted. But in reality it’s more like 0.3 lm to 5000 lm.
Ish would be enough.
I meant per light. Not in general for all FSM lights
Fw3a and D4S
As battery a 30Q.
Data for discharge from HKJ.
Hm, it sounds already complicated.
never fear shadows…it means a light shines nearby
how about the black Basen with gold writing…it has 60a pulse
never fear shadows…it means a light shines nearby
I have an authentic basen 5000mah with 50/60a pulse. there’s also the basen 4500mah with 40/60a pulse. have you checked those? I don’t have your set up to check the specs in the light itself. I almost bought the 4500 but it doesn’t have Basen written 4 times on the top of the battery like my other one does
never fear shadows…it means a light shines nearby
Where can you purchase basen 26650?
Stepped ramp modes for xpl hi 5000k. 4, 34, 110, 246, 481, 1016, 1906 lumen.. number will depends on the battery.. atleast we get an idea..
Awesome…thanks for that…I have the same emitters.
What happens if change the stepped ramps to like just 2 steps? Does it just split the output in half?
When I'm spending mon€y foolishly, I like to do it wi$ely...
I have all the flashlights I need, but not as many as I want...
I dont know how to do that.. i have 7 modes in stepped, plus turbo..
At first I blinded myself a few times with this feature as well. And I couldn’t figure out what I was doing, or doing wrong anyway.
But after figuring it out, I’m happy with the way it functions. I do have to click and hold longer than expected, but there’s sufficient delaying before ramping up off moon to land in that I’m no longer bothered by it.
I’m still not ever sure what I’m going to get for a double click from off – last used mode, some random mode, or turbo. I’m aiming for turbo, but I’m not sure I always get it. And speaking of double click, the thermal reduction is so smooth you don’t notice it, so if you double click to turbo, and the light backs off a smidgen due to throttling, and you double click again, basically nothing happens cause you go back to turbo.
Since I just ordered my green D4S from Richard yesterday and I don’t actually have one yet, I built another one. This time in solid copper.
I made a Te/Cu head surrounding the Noctigon 33mm Quad MCPCB with Angie optic and mated it to the full copper body of an 18650 Sinner light. Not having my springs yet from Blue, I’m making do with the “measely” 5685 lumens out the front provided by an Sony VTC5A 18650.
(output courtesy of 4 Samsung LH351D 5000K 80 CRI emitters)
Hank is really on a roll, for sure!
From L to R: Fireflies ROT66, D4s, DQG Tiny 26650 3th & Haikelite SC26 (26350 tube).
Since the floor, ceiling, and number of steps can be whatever you want, it spaces the middle modes evenly on a visually-linear scale. Or as close as it can get, at least, from the 150 available levels.
With just 2 steps, you’ll get just the floor and the ceiling. Nothing between. Modes are low, high, and maybe turbo.
I say “maybe turbo” because it depends on where the ceiling is configured. If the ceiling is set to 150 (one click), there is no separate turbo.
With 3 steps, it’ll be floor, ceiling, and halfway between on the ramp. So it’d do low, med, high, and maybe turbo.
Or to set it up for steps of 25, 50, 75, 100, 125, and 150… Do 25 clicks for floor, 26 clicks for ceiling, and 5 steps. Five regular output levels plus turbo.
If you tell it to use just 1 step, it’ll get a little confused and act like you configured it for 2 steps instead. But you can still make it a one-mode light by setting the floor and ceiling to the same number, I think. Unless it divides by zero. That’s a possibility. Probably should have tested that.
For use as a 1-mode light, I’d recommend just using momentary/tactical mode.
I meant in post 493, the middle light. In reference to the basen, someone gave it to me but the ones I’ve been seeing don’t seem legit. Liion wholesalers has the 4500mah basen in stock
never fear shadows…it means a light shines nearby
Thanks for sharing these figures. I am probably going to draw fire from saying this. TBH, I am a bit underwhelmed and disappointed that the lumen outputs will drop below 1000 lumens in less than 2 minute? Is this behavior due to timed stepdown? Since this flashlight has more mass compared to the D4, which should help it to dissipate heat better, I was hoping it should be able to output half the max lumens for sustained period.
Are the figures similar for the other LEDs: XP-G2 S4 and XP-L HI ?
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