X-ML de-doming method with 100% success?

[MattSPL]

@Slewflash

Update: My STL-V2 has been revived! Due to the shoddy pocket knife work, there was still a large piece of the dome left. I took a razor and sliced it until roughly 0.5-1mm (can’t tell exactly, but it’s 1mm or less) and now my STL-V2’s throw has been increased from 48,700 (domed) to 53,400 (dedomed).
Hurray! I did expect a bigger jump in throw though…

Even though the lumen output decreased, the throw was increased and because the STL-V2 was mainly a thrower to begin with I just made it a better thrower Going by ceiling bounce lux readings the lumen output has decreased by roughly 35%. Quite a lot actually, but it’s worth it for me because I learned something :bigsmile:

Thanks for the update

Do you have a proper light meter, or is there a reliable app you can recommend?

Cheers
Matt

[DarkSide]

Do you have a drop-in your not using? sink it to the copper pill..Heck, you have some copper pipe you can grind to a flat clean surface. Attach with thermal adhesive. A hair dryer i dont think has enough output to heat the copper sink that will melt the adhesive. You will need a decent solder iron.The hotter the better. High heat very quick and you can expect no damage. I haven't screwed one emitter yet...And im really good and killing expensive new emitters and diodes..

[Slewflash]

@MattSPL

Thanks for the update

Do you have a proper light meter, or is there a reliable app you can recommend?

Cheers
Matt

I have a proper light meter, I have tried using my smartphone’s ambient light sensor but it only gives very general readings. Something along the lines of 1, 20,000 and 100,000 (I don’t even know what the units are).

@DarkSide

Do you have a drop-in your not using? sink it to the copper pill…Heck, you have some copper pipe you can grind to a flat clean surface. Attach with thermal adhesive. A hair dryer i dont think has enough output to heat the copper sink that will melt the adhesive. You will need a decent solder iron.The hotter the better. High heat very quick and you can expect no damage. I haven’t screwed one emitter yet…And im really good and killing expensive new emitters and diodes…

I do have a drop-in, I guess I’ll try that then. But another suggestion; how about placing it on an extremely neatly folded cube of aluminium foil, and then blow torching for a few seconds.

Anyway, here are the results of my work! The 7G5-V2 has a higher overall output, no idea why it looks dimmer in the photos, but the STL-V2 blows it out the water completely for throw. It’s a real lightsabre now. And I’m pretty confident I can do this on almost all the lights I want to. This really is a close to 100% success rate :bigsmile:

7G5-V2:

STL-V2:

7G5-V2 on left, STL-V2 on right:

Note: The 7G5-V2 has 46,600 lux. The STL-V2 has 53,400, but maybe I should measure it again. It sure looks more than 53,400.

Edit: I just want to say how pleased I am with the results, and I want to thank HAL for introducing me to this technique :bigsmile: :bigsmile: :bigsmile:

[MattSPL]

The STL-V2 does look a lot more intense. Thanks for the pics

[HAL]

Slewflash

Wow some amazing results! strange that you saw a 35% drop in lumen and the registered only a 15% drop considering both lights are throwers. Anyway the beamshots speak for themselves!

MattSPL,

Great idea with the dremel polishing head, I just tried it out myself and managed to smooth out whats left of the dome, though I cant quite get rid of the lightly frosted texture. Color didn’t change much since I had already sliced so close to the LED.

[ILIKEFLASHLIGHTS]

Is the dome made out of glass or some type of polycarbonate?

[HAL]

It behaves like soft but slightly brittle silicon if that makes any sense.

[Slewflash]

It might be because my ceiling is really high up… and that a focused beam and a diffused beam at the same brightness don’t light up the room at the same intensity. I don’t really know, because I don’t have an integrating sphere to accurately measure. But outdoors there is no perceived brightness from the STL-V2 and the 7G5-V2. The spill on each is quite low, so your eyes are more attracted to the hotspot, and the STL-V2 actually appears brighter (for me anyway).

And ILF, I think the dome is made out of silicone. It’s soft when you cut into it.

[DarkSide]

@ILIKEFLASHLIGHTS

Is the dome made out of glass or some type of polycarbonate?

Um , yes i agree its a durable silcone lens. I have played with them and holding it with tweezers after removed is not neccessary. Its pliable and will not lose its shape. It will tint with in super high heat. A hot solder iron does little or no damage if touched for a second or two.

SLewfish , i wouldn't try the tin foil. The heat has to be hot enough to melt the adhesive in the lens frame like section of the lens. Copper wil transfer the heat as fast as it can pull it from the iron..Just a few seconds to remove and only seconds to cool to the touch. I can send you a milled copper slug if your going to be doing a lot of these.

[Slewflash]

@DarkSide

@ILIKEFLASHLIGHTS

Is the dome made out of glass or some type of polycarbonate?

Um , yes i agree its a durable silcone lens. I have played with them and holding it with tweezers after removed is not neccessary. Its pliable and will not lose its shape. It will tint with in super high heat. A hot solder iron does little or no damage if touched for a second or two.

SLewfish , i wouldn’t try the tin foil. The heat has to be hot enough to melt the adhesive in the lens frame like section of the lens. Copper wil transfer the heat as fast as it can pull it from the iron…Just a few seconds to remove and only seconds to cool to the touch. I can send you a milled copper slug if your going to be doing a lot of these.

I greatly appreciate the offer DarkSide, but I probably won’t be doing this on a daily basis seeing as I only have one light coming in every few weeks. Because this is just for personal use I think slicing the dome off is sufficient for now. But thanks though :bigsmile:

[HAL]

@DarkSide

@ILIKEFLASHLIGHTS

Is the dome made out of glass or some type of polycarbonate?

Um , yes i agree its a durable silcone lens. I have played with them and holding it with tweezers after removed is not neccessary. Its pliable and will not lose its shape. It will tint with in super high heat. A hot solder iron does little or no damage if touched for a second or two.

SLewfish , i wouldn’t try the tin foil. The heat has to be hot enough to melt the adhesive in the lens frame like section of the lens. Copper wil transfer the heat as fast as it can pull it from the iron…Just a few seconds to remove and only seconds to cool to the touch. I can send you a milled copper slug if your going to be doing a lot of these.

Hi, Have you tried this method with xml’s or just luminus emitters? saablaster claims to have a 50% success rate with a similar heating method.

[agenthex]

@HAL

I’ve stumbled across an easier way to de-dome an XM-L that should yield close to 100% success if one is careful (maybe its been discussed before but I didn’t see it). I just dont know how much light is lost in the process since I didn’t have the good sense to take before and after beamshots.

Anyway The method is to take a razor, like this (the sharpest, thinnest thing I could think of) and just slice the dome off as close to the surface and possible, leaving maybe 1mm or less of material. Mine actually came out quite untidy but the beam still had no artifacts, though this probably affects brightness a bit.

I did it to a UF 3mode dropin. The beam is about 50% smaller and more intense, with a slightly warmer hotspot. Another pro of this method is that the thin layer remaining above the phosphor means that there will be no degradation of the LED over time through oxidation etc. My previous attempt at de-doming ended up ripping off some of the phosphor, which resulted in a purple bulls-eye in the hotspot.

It would be nice if someone with a luxmeter could replicate this and check the results.

I suspect the throw improvements are just from different focusing. In many of the lights I have, just moving the reflector results in a brighter center spot. But it often results in a lower quality hotspot (brighter in the middle, rather than even across). I wonder if that’s what people who’ve tried this sees.

[_the]

I just finished polishing my de-domed emitter with Dremel (thanks for the tip MattSPL!)

Now the dome is really thin and quite smooth. The light has also significantly warmer tint and better throw than yesterday.

Quickly checked the throw figures at 4m (yes, quite short distance) and didn't believe the meter.. Had to test with MPP1 and got the generally accepted 48.8kcd.. So this must be true: De-domed FF STL-V6 gives now 93.1kcd(!!) :party:

[Slewflash]

@*the*

I just finished polishing my de-domed emitter with Dremel (thanks for the tip MattSPL!)

Now the dome is really thin and quite smooth. The light has also significantly warmer tint and better throw than yesterday.

Quickly checked the throw figures at 4m (yes, quite short distance) and didn’t believe the meter… Had to test with MPP1 and got the generally accepted 48.8kcd… So this must be true: De-domed FF STL-V6 gives now 93.1kcd(!!) :party:

93.1k lux! That’s insane! Congrats! Now time for me to polish my emitter up

[Chicago_X]

The product LED Seal helps out quite a bit after de-doming by filling in the scuffs and cracks left behind in the residual material, in a manner very similar to the liquid "lens saver." Very little is required to make a difference in beam quality, as the scattering effect is noticeably diminished

It also helps protect the phosphor in those cases where the silicone material is completely removed. In this case, a slightly thicker application is used as a protective layer.

I've been using a single can for over a year now, including application of a protective layer on over 30 landscaping fixtures, and it's still over half-full.

[SashiX]

Wow, I must say that the results are amazing, guyz Congrats!

@Matt: amazing throw on that Mini, mate Great job!

Question: will dedome add more “artifacts” with SMO?

[MattSPL]

Yeah, some great results in this thread. Thanks HAL for starting this thread :bigsmile:

I’ll see if i can get some outdoor beamshots done tonight. It’s been raining for 2 days now

[Slewflash]

Okay after some fine tuning, I’ve managed to get my STL-V2 up to 79,300 lux. I don’t have access to anything which can completely smooth the silicone, but I figure once I do then the lux will shoot straight up.

[MattSPL]

@Slewflash

Okay after some fine tuning, I’ve managed to get my STL-V2 up to 79,300 lux. I don’t have access to anything which can completely smooth the silicone, but I figure once I do then the lux will shoot straight up.

That’s already an impressive increase :bigsmile:

[HAL]

Looking good guys!! some awesome figures!!!