Yes
All the discussion the last few days was about changing that , right ?
No, we said we were surprised by the change, an experienced engineer explained why TF probably did this, we said we could accept it. Modding would be slightly more difficult yet as easy as with a SRK. Tom tested wear and tear.
Now we have gotten an explanation for the change from TF. and we can accept it even more.
All “discussion” points have been addressed and/or followed up by tests and expert input.
I believe that Thorfire at this moment really wants to do the Q8 right. And because we (BLF, the Q8 team) are designing the Q8 in cooperation with Thorfire, so there is 2 parties involved, right not neccessarily always means what the Q8 team thinks is best, also partly what Thorfire thinks is best. And there is good reason also to accept some solutions the way Thorfire thinks is best: first because their dedication to the project increases when parts of the design are their own (very important!), but also simply because they are an experienced (although not high end) flashlight manufacturer: they know stuff about manufacturing that we don’t know, they know what the possibilities are of their equipment, they know how to control costs that are involved in manufacturing, etc. etc. From the first contact with Thorfire we tried to communicate that in the end it is up to them to make a good flashlight. Because the Q8-team does not have the same know-how about every step in the process as a manufacturer.
So it is not 100% telling them what to do, it is a joint project, and if Thorfire is dedicated and things turn out like we hope, their influence on the Q8 may just make it a better light than if we would have done the complete design ourselves.
I understand that this is a Q8 team and Thorfire cooperation , so both parties should agree in something .
To be honest , I thought the possible problems that screws could cause (Tom E and other members explained that in the last pages) were important enough to get the driver retaining ring design back …
I may have given a somewhat wrong impression with the details. Sure the ring would have been nice, but after seeing the close-up pics of the screw holes, they are done the right way, should eliminate pressure. Also if a ring loosens, not so easy for non-tech buyer to tighten, while about everybody has a Phillips head screw driver. I got 275 hard tightenings done on proto #2 and no appreciable damage yet. At the wear points, still have good electrical contact, still seems like plenty enough tracing material/metal left.
The average buyer will recharge batteries perhaps one a month. The average BLF buyer will buy a newer, better light before the Q8 wears out. Either way, it’s durable enough and you can stop training your arms with it 
In an attempt to help The Miller, and to put it all in one place as much for myself as others, I believe the below quoted posts are the pertinent ones. I have added MY INTERPRETATION of what is posted elsewhere, I have absolutely no ‘inside’ knowledge.
[edited to add The Millers below clarifications.]
Almost spot on Lazy-R-us, except
The plastic cover ring will be held in place with glue and have holes for the screws holding the driver.
And it seems a thicker ledboard is doable.
I used to play a lot of softball couple years back, so maybe my forearms are getting weak. Approaching 60, you don't get any stronger - that's for sure 
I'm thinking it's look'n pretty darn good. I may have dragged us down a bit by getting way down and dirty in the details and analysis (some might disagree ), but I'm happier at this point since we began, seeing the progress and responsiveness from TF on all this.
Sounds great. The 2mm extra space for stars will definitely be nice, so this is all making things better AND coming toward a conclusion! It does sound to me like all concerns about the driver board are well addressed. It sounds like it's easy enough to not use the screws, and doesn't require a machine shop to deal with that either, so it's all good!
Nice. :sunglasses:
Although as an engineer and manufacturing guy (and all-around obsessive analytical) if I was ThorFire, I would be wondering if the increase from 1.2mm to 1.6mm was a worthy request, or just a “bigger must be better” mentality at work. I know we have lots of anecdotal experience here that thick DTP copper MCPCBs are good, yup - but what is the real, quantifiable performance increase? Increasing from 1.2mm to 1.6mm is at minimum 33% more copper raw material cost, and who knows if they (or likely their tier2 supplier) are tooled up to make 1.6mm? maybe 1.2mm is the standard depth and other thicknesses require new tooling and the cost is even greater? (note: I know nothing about MCPCB production, maybe they can easily be made in infinitely variable thicknesses, idk)
But is increasing the cost of the MCPCB reflected accurately in performance increase? In identical lights with the only variable being MCPCB thickness, what is the difference in Tj? Temp difference at the LED shelf, or the exterior body? Is there a measurable and significant increase in Lumens? If the difference between 1.2mm and 1.6mm turned out to be only 50lm @30s in a 6000lm light, would it be worth adding $0.50 or $1.00 (or however much) cost to the light?
This is just the type of stuff that goes through my mind. I’d love to know - quantitatively, give me numbers, hard data, not anecdotes - the impact of a 1.6mm vs 1.2mm MCPCB. I’d assume (hope?) ThorFire engineering wonders about these things too. It would be awesome if they did some sort of comparison test to find out.
LED's are the easiest thing to replace after batteries. Anyone with a cigarette lighter and and tweezers can change leds. Parts going bad, now that's different. Still, Tom E's tests sound pretty good.
The question is mostly answered by the last prototype, the performance is way better than we expected, 12mm does the job apparently.
I do not so much expect an improvement of a thicker board coming from better spreading of the heat, but from a thicker board being stiffer. The board is screwed down to the shelf with 2 screws, potentialy deforming the board. The thicker the board, the stiffer and the likelier that it is pressed flat over the entire surface by those two screws.
This does not take into account the influence of the pressure that the bezel via the reflector and led centering rings applies on the ledboard, I would not know how high that pressure is.
djozz, that’s why they make strain gauges! 
Good point regarding stiffness, I didn’t consider that aspect when typing my response. Though my thought process would still be the same - is a 1.6mm board sufficiently stiffer than a 1.2mm board to warrant the extra cost? And can you prove/back it up with data?
(I can’t help it, that’s how my mind works, lol. It’s a sickness)
To reiterate, I’m not saying we shouldn’t ask for a thicker board, it probably is worth it to us to satisfy our fetish for more copper, even if we don’t have that strain gauge or thermocouple data. But if I was a product manager or design engineer at a flashlight manufacturer who , this is what I’d be wondering, and looking to test before I spent that money to put it into production. Heck, if I had the time and equipment, I’d be looking to test it out of curiosity.
Biggest PLUS on board size for me is 2mm bigger diameter, better heatpath and easier to fit other stars on the area where it sits.
I’m like you sac02, 1)I often dislike unnecessary copper for its weight, 2)I love to generate numbers, the more if they prove a BLF-myth wrong
So my position with the thicker board is not rigid: if Thorfire is willing to do it (like it seems now) we will have a board that may perform better and is easier to handle (possibly also for assembly by Thorfire). If it proves a difficult negotiation (which it seems not), I’m fine keeping it like the prototype (which performs great as it is).
Unless a thicker board and more copper causes a manufacturing problem (and it appears not to be the case) I would personally go for the thicker copper. I believe the wider and thicker the copper contact with the structure of the body and heat radiators the better. Heat is the enemy of most things electronic.
The faster you can move heat away from the LEDs, the lower the junction (and other component) temperature, the longer the life. In a “block” of Copper, I believe the increased volume will speed up the transfer. With a good thermal path to the cooling fins, the whole process will be improved. And you get to say “It’s a monster; look how hot it gets” a bit faster. Please be gentle if you disagree. It has been a very very long time since I had thermodynamics. Quantitatively, without actual measurements, I suspect that for normal sustainable brightness, there won’t be a whole lot of difference with more Copper. But I would still do thicker. Belt and suspenders.
Also getting a good grease (look at the PC chip cooling sites) and properly applying it would probably be the one mod I would do. The grease I would apply will be much more expensive that what I think TF is likely to use. Grease should not be used to fill big gaps. It must be applied as thinly as possible. Things should be as flat as possible. The grease is just for pretty much invisible surface imperfections having air gaps eliminated. If the transfer support on the case is done badly and is rough or full of machining grooves, that would likely be a significant cooling issue. And if you explore the high end thermal greases, beware that some of it is not an electrical insulator.
When you do the grease you can set the screw tightness where you want it.
A more complicated “fix”, if there is room, would be to let the owner add a stiffener ring under the screws. But a small quality PCB is probably stiff enough. If you do not over-tighten the screws. That is a complete swag, but probably reasonable. I probably won’t do it to my Q8s.
TF is really stepping up here
Monetary gain is not their prime goal, and they really want to make a smashing light.
So we trust the good decisions will be made, all want a win!
It has been a rollercoaster but now trust is build (for example our Contact speaks English but is no engineer. Some things we ask are like hocus pocus to him yet now he gets he can translate and convey for he gets it is true info (same for little old me having to convey things feeling like magic )
It seems we are getting really close now
So, like… Next Week? 