You are correct, it is and there already are wing ice lights fitted in the outboard side of the engine nacels . But they frequently fail and are not to be relied on. Old (ish) aircraft, operated away from base maintenance, getting important stuff done is a challange, getting other stuff done, not so easy!
I suggested two lights just because I am not sure any one makes one light that matches your desired beam characteristics at both extremes, pencil beam and flood.
Can the existing icing lights be updated to LED bulbs for greater reliability and less sensitivity to vibration? Based on my old 1967 Triumph Bonneville incandescent lights do not like vibration.
The Uniquefire UF-T20 is excellent inside, but to me the external shape is a serious drawback. It feels and looks primitive.
That is exactly why I am here. No one does make one, so I am here looking for ideas to make my own. Well one does, the A2Aviator, comes close and earlier someone else mentioned a Sunwayman with a second down pointing emitter in red , they do both come very close .
Could be done, yes physically I am sure no problem. But legally with all the approvals for aircraft, if there is not an off the shelf option already approved, no.
Even if there were lamps available I can’t see our lot paying for them if they cost more.
But even so, it is still a requirement for us to carry a torch anyhow
Cockpit and instrument lighting is also very poor. Think 1950’s Landrover with Lucas electrics.
Have been flying since 1992, and for a job since 2004 and have a box full of lamps, all a compromise in one way or another, so this time I am on a mission to get one I am happy with, even if I have to machine parts on the lathe myself
I agree, two lights are probably necessary, since the requirements are at the far opposite ends of the spectrum. Granted, those two lights could be hosted in one body, but most lights like that are rather … awkward. I’ve also never seen one which wasn’t reflector-based for the throw beam, which violates the pencil-beam no-spill requirement.
FWIW, all-flood is the entire point of the Zebralight “0” series headlamps, like H502 and H602. It’s a bare LED (mule) with 120 degree flood and no reflector. Just a lens, and a matte glow-in-the-dark shallow cone around the emitter to help bounce more of the 120-to-180 degree light forward without producing a hotspot.
I find it confusing that you’re using a reflector-based light for a no-spill thrower, since that will produce a spill area. Even on really tightly-focused lights like the Jacob A60, there’s still some spill. But maybe some amount of spill is okay?
I’d rather have no spill and a tight beam. but not for distance and throw, but for ease of firing out the window, as explained before.
I am only using the Q2 because I happen to have it here NOW, and no know different with regard to tight beams. Hence this thread. and why I am asking about them.
So if not a reflector based light for a tight beam, what is the best ? the aspheric lens. Not got one of those yet….or maybe I have? the Q2 or is that a TIR?
The SingFires as shown below in my mod thread link both have cheap plastic lenses… Flat on one side , curved on the other.
The Q2 is a very similar design to the LED Lenser. its Lens system is almost identical to the Lenser…but better Doing a ceiling bounce test, the rest of the ons illumination is almost identical from spot to flood, and it has double the flood of the LED Lenser.
As to why I am using it…Usin g it because I have it here, and know no better. It is not quite what I want, but with a bit of modding it soon will be closer. It has XP-G emitter New driver on order, I made a new body for it yesterday to take th zoom mech and an 18650 instead of the AA, and a also a new new tail cap clicky switch from a Nitecore on its way to fit the new body.
As i have said in this or another thread, I have bought in the last month
Fenix E35 ultimate
LED Lenser M3R really poor wide angle zoom
SingFire SF132
SignFire SF707C
Coast HP1 (yet to arrive)
Suprabeam Q2
the Q2 has the best zoom of the lot, from a perfectly focused nice square image of the LED to the widest flood, but poor software. only high and a barely different low. Hence the new driver .
But if any of the zooms, after customisation, are not to my liking, then this second idea of two fixed beams (Spot and mule type flood) built in to my own body is the next idea.
it has been 22 years of getting various lamps, all capable in what they do, but none perfect, so this is my current quest.
If I could find a really tight spot fixed focus virtually spill free lamp, (just the head will do) of about 1 inch diameter , maybe 1.5 inch max, but the narrower the better, I can make a housing for it to take a 18650 battery, and second driver unit for a moonlight mule flood.
That XinTD C8 V5 XP-G2 S2 2B 18650 Flashlight does sound sort of perfect. Mode 4 with moonlight start is great. .I could combine that with one bare LED firing down…maybe even use the original XinTD C8 driver, and switch between the two LED’s by switching the driver output to one or other LED,
All just ideas I am throwing around
I just missed out on a 40% discount from SureFire. I got a mate in the USA to phone (they wont sell to outside the USA) them and order me a FM54 diffuser…not listed on their site, but available.
They gave him a 40% discount code, up to the value of $1200…and I only bough the diffuser. Was very tempted by the new 1000Lumen R1 Lawman. not for this project, just of the hell of it.
Should have ordered the R1 and the A2 Aviator too. I was about to , sent my mate the e-mail…but he had already placed the order…probably just as well. Did not truly need to spend another $550 USD though
Like their reflectors.
Never found the square beam to be a problem, I quite like it.
Dos this look genuine?
Is Sunwayman another chinese maker of budget lights and this is original, or are they a ‘quality’ manufacturer and this is a rip off?
This may be the perfect light for me with the modified Carloco optic
I don’t think C21C suit your need unless modify it, this is review by _the_
That ebay seller is HKEquipment, also member here. This is his webstore.
You can find Sunwayman in many US stores, I suggest ask Calvin (Illumination supply) for some discount.
Hmm, interesting. From the pictures, it looked like a reflector. If it gives a perfect image of the LED though, it’s probably an aspheric or maybe some sort of hybrid aspheric TIR.
That square LED image is what any aspheric will provide, with virtually nothing around it. For example, this is the beam of a SK-68:
But a light with a really tight reflector beam, such as the Jacob A60 or XinTD C8 XP-G2, looks more like this:
A recoil reflector looks the same, only without the spill area… just a nice, round hotspot.
The optic is both reflector and some sort of shaped plastic unit with lens centre
Here are couple of beam shots, with lamp 47cm from the wall from the wall at both full zoom 62 cm wide and central hotspot 10 cm wide
Colour balance set on 4800 1/ 25th second at f3.5 ISO 100
Also shots of the reflector and lens assemble and my unfinished host to take an 18650.
I think it is near perfect. It was suggested earlier on this or another thread.
Swap the red emitter for white and change the optic, almost exactly what I am trying to build if the zoom options don’t work out.
single 18650 power, so it can be used as head torch for flight paperwork. and front beam for out the window.
OK, moonlight not quite low enough , but the best option so far.
I think this conversation has turned loop-de-loops so many times, some people are starting to get confused about what is being asked for. Let’s see if I’ve got it correct. You want one thing to carry that does both a pencil beam spot with no spill and a super wide flood to fill the cockpit with a low level of light. Is that correct? If so, my recommendation is that you build it yourself. You’ve already shown that you know how to operate a lathe. You’re talking about replacing LED’s and drivers. Why don’t you just make the thing you want? Buy a de-domed XP-G2 from James3. Add a quality aspheric lens like this. You don’t have to buy from them. That’s just the first place I caught in a Google search. Get a driver from Richard at Mountain Electronics. You’ll need to decide what kind of switch/button you want to use, and get one, and make sure the driver is suitable for that kind of switch/button. Basically, there are two kinds: a clicky that turns power completely on and off or an e-switch that works through the driver’s software. Then, turn out a host for yourself on the lathe. It’s been done enough times before on here, you can surely find inspiration looking through the pages of this site. A couple places to start are Sinner’s custom hosts, and the Scratch Made Contest we had a few months ago.
You could make a zoomie, with a range from perfect square die to super wide flood. The square die is with lens out, and flood is with lens in, so make it such that the lens can be pulled all the way in to just above the top of the emitter. The closer you get the lens to the emitter, the wider your flood can be. Also, you don’t want anything extending past the end of the lens, because it will impede the flood. Another option is to make a fixed lens at square die focus, and get a diffuser for it that will turn it into a wide area light. This will be simpler to turn on a lathe, but then you have to keep up with the diffuser.
Then, of course, there is the option of using additional emitter(s) to cover wide area lighting. But, that will require a different driver, capable of switching two circuits (to the different emitters) and you will have to make a place in your host for the additional emitter(s) where it won’t interfere with the pencil beam. You could drill some holes around the driver portion of the head, and put some cheapie 5mm epoxy LED’s all the way around there. If you used 6 or 8 of the 350mA 5mm LED’s, you’d have a nice even illumination at a low level of lighting. Just tail-stand the light, and it will glow from all sides.
Edit: There is a thread here about getting dual output driver from one 18650.
That is the way with forums, everyone tries to help but often don’t all read the whole post first, so i end up repeating , then we get sidetracked on to other topics. That is the way with all forums.
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Exactly, which is why my first line of the OP says
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That was the sort of idea, hence the initial request . But threading is not a strong point. making the tool tips and then accurate cutting with a Selaey SM27 hobby lathe is a little tricky. Did a 1mm pitch thread yesterday on a host I am making to convert a Q2 to 18650 . It works but not the best thead in the history of lathe work!! :~
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All good info thanks, I had not considered making the lens reflector section, but worth a look.
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So does de-doming, because it allows the lens closer to the emitter, mean that demoing makes a wider flood, though normally without a lens it makes a smaller more point source? I though I had read this before, then then I was told, no, that demoing makes a narrower beam.
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this was my initial thought, yes, If I could find that small diameter head unit, I could add my own bare ‘mule’ emitters rather like the SunwaymanC21C.
Mounted on a head clip that is probably the perfect solution. Mule emitters pointing down with pencil beam above. Could use a pair of drivers, with two lots of wiring. Might be issues if you tried to turn both on at once, and using the body as common ground. Guess I’d run the mule on a separate circuit.
I hadn’t thought about the de-doming allowing the lens closer to the die surface. I haven’t tried it myself, but it does make some sense. If the lens is closer to the die, it will make a wider angle flood.
I was recommending a de-domed emitter for the sake of a tighter hot-spot. Actually, thinking again, you don’t need that. The aspheric will perfectly focus the beam with practically no spill. Making that spot smaller by de-doming isn’t necessary for what you are wanting to do with it. If you check out the link I gave for the de-domed emitters, James3 has a picture in the OP of the difference de-doming makes in the size of the hot-spot. That photo is with the emitter in a reflector, so ignore the roundness of the hot-spot and the presence of spill. Yours won’t be round or have any spill, if you use an aspheric lens and focus it properly.
I had a browse through that lens site you pointed me to.
But not sure what criteria I need . Obviously diameter of the housing. I’d probably go for 25-30mm no more.
But what else? Focal length etc to consider. how do you specify a lens when ordering g? Or would you just tell them what you want and they pick a lens for you?
I have held off from e-mailing them yet. I started then deleted it till I had more info of what exactly i’d need to make that thin beam
I would have suspected the need for a reflector behind the lens to catch and re-direct the photons join gout of the emitter sideways, hitting the side walls of the head unit.
or does the AS lens go as close as possible to the emitter? Not having seen any flashlights like this I have nothing to go on.
You will need to know the focal distance from the back of the lens, so you can make the zoom on your host to be the same distance from the back of the lens to the front of the emitter die. You don’t need or want a reflector, because it basically ‘does the same thing’ so having both will mess up the focus. That is, unless you’re an engineer and can perfectly match the reflector and lens to use them as a catadioptric system. When using the aspheric, you will be losing the light that hits the walls inside the unit. In fact, you should make everything inside the head except the emitter die itself to be black, so none of it gets reflected through the lens. Any of that stray light that gets through will be out of focus, so it will become a sort of spill. If you want to get fancy, you can use a Wavien Collar to recycle that stray light back to the emitter die.
A aspheric is not that big. I did a comparison a few years ago where I included a Dereelight:
Beam at 100 meter:
Size (Number two from right with the square head):
It is a 1x18650 light. The other lights are 1x18650, 2xCR123, 2xAA or 4xAA.
Look for a SupFire M1. It has a really tight beam (too tight for me) and very very soft and faint spill because of the hybrid smo/op reflector. Roughly the size if a C8 and uses 18650's. Usually $10 to $15.
OK, got that. Thanks, so you make it so the focal point is a the die. So that give the best parallel beam. Obvious really …I am forgetting all I learnt in physics lessons at school
So I’ll go back and check the site. I guess they give different focal lengths for different diameters. Thanks
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And you then zoom the lens backwards to almost touching the die to get the widest flood.
Got it thanks
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Ok, thanks. I like the idea of those collars. but that then will limit the wide beam too, I guess because you want be able to gt the back of the lens so close to the emitter.