LiIon VENTING Tests 2017! Round #2 / UPDATES July,17,2017

[DBSAR]

@The Miller

@DBSAR

@The Miller

looking forward to it!

can you charge 1 cell to the max, deplete another and connect them in series?

interesting idea, maybe i will try that. connect a dead cell in series to a full charged cell, then dead short them to see what happens.

No no not a dead cell
I think I want to use the BLF fund I have to get you four good high drain cells
Deplete one, charge the rest and let them charge the depleted one. It is like the worse case scenario for cells in series and with the GT very valuable.
Gonna on you now

Goo point. I don’t have any high-drain cells to sacrifice for the tests this time, only laptop pulls & bad Ultrafire cells.

[DBSAR]

@kramer5150

Definitely following this one, cant wait for the vids too.

You can youtube search for battery flame/fire test to get more ideas. I have seen people do this with cell phone and RC car/plane batteries, although not nearly as extensive as yours is going to be. They might also give you some more ideas in regard to safety.

Thanks!!

I wouldn’t mind donating some half used Duracell CR123 primary cells, and I also have some fully functional laptop pull LG 18650s I could donate. Shoot me a PM if you’d be interested.

I live in Canada though, and its not really worth the cost of shipping.

[DBSAR]

Updates with first intro video in the OP.

[teacher]

@HKJ

Venting cells is usual not a big events, it happens sometimes during my test. The excitement occurs if the venting gas is ignited.

HKJ…. Is the venting gas dangerous to breathe? I have heard various opinions, ranging from almost immediate death to not really. :person_facepalming:

Since you have had it happen in what I am guessing was an enclosed area…. What say you…. from experience.

Thank you in advance……… :+1:

---

Nice thread DBSAR, thank you. :+1:

[DBSAR]

@teacher

@HKJ

Venting cells is usual not a big events, it happens sometimes during my test. The excitement occurs if the venting gas is ignited.

HKJ…. Is the venting gas dangerous to breathe? I have heard various opinions, ranging from almost immediate death to not really. :person_facepalming:

Since you have had it happen in what I am guessing was an enclosed area…. What say you…. from experience.

Thank you in advance……… :+1:

---

Nice thread DBSAR, thank you. :+1:

one of the most toxic & serious gasses created during a Lithium-Ion battery burn/vent is hydrofluoric acid. (a compound of hydrogen fluoride, which causes severe & permanent soft tissue damage if breathed in. >> Hydrogen fluoride - Wikipedia

[teacher]

@DBSAR

one of the most toxic & serious gasses created during a Lithium-Ion battery burn/vent is hydrofluoric acid. (a compound of hydrogen fluoride, which causes severe & permanent soft tissue damage if breathed in. >> Hydrogen fluoride - Wikipedia

OK, I figured it probably was not good……
Thank you for explaining just how bad it is & can be DBSAR. :+1:

[HKJ]

@teacher

HKJ…. Is the venting gas dangerous to breathe? I have heard various opinions, ranging from almost immediate death to not really. :person_facepalming:

Since you have had it happen in what I am guessing was an enclosed area…. What say you…. from experience.

Depends, as long as the cell only vent it is not a problem, if you get flames it is problematic.

[teacher]

@HKJ

@teacher

HKJ…. Is the venting gas dangerous to breathe? I have heard various opinions, ranging from almost immediate death to not really. :person_facepalming:

Since you have had it happen in what I am guessing was an enclosed area…. What say you…. from experience.

Depends, as long as the cell only vent it is not a problem, if you get flames it is problematic.

Thanks HKJ, that was/is what I was looking for.

• Vent……. No Flame……… No problem
• Vent……. Flame…………… PROBLEM … XXX … Do Not Breathe … XXX

Got it…. :+1:

[DBSAR]

Update to OP, ( Impact test added)

[MRsDNF]

I’m sure thats a good thing that nothing spectacular happened.

[patmurris]

I’d like to see two fully charged 18650 in serie and shorted. That’s what may happen if you put one cell upside down in a SRK style light - not sure whether the two other cells would moderate or aggravate the short…

Well at least… just short a fully charged 30Q or VTC6 and let us see… :smiling_imp:

[DBSAR]

@patmurris

I’d like to see two fully charged 18650 in serie and shorted. That’s what may happen if you put one cell upside down in a SRK style light - not sure whether the two other cells would moderate or aggravate the short…

Well at least… just short a fully charged 30Q or VTC6 and let us see… :smiling_imp:

I will be doing those tests with 30Q cells once they arrive. (supplied by the Miller to do some safety tests on these cells as they are the recommended cells to use in the new BLF Q8.

[djozz]

Recently I accidentally shorted a high current LG cell (the dark brown one) and nothing spectacular happened: the internal fuse blew and that was that. I guess that will happen with two 30Q cells shorted in series.

[hIKARInoob]

@djozz

Recently I accidentally shorted a high current LG cell (the dark brown one) and nothing spectacular happened: the internal fuse blew and that was that. I guess that will happen with two 30Q cells shorted in series.

How long did it take for the fuse to blow?

[djozz]

@hIKARInoob

@djozz

Recently I accidentally shorted a high current LG cell (the dark brown one) and nothing spectacular happened: the internal fuse blew and that was that. I guess that will happen with two 30Q cells shorted in series.

How long did it take for the fuse to blow?

Seconds!

It happened inside a flashlight build. I closed the battery tube, clicked the switch and no light came out. Knowing that a direct battery short is always an option I immediately screwed off the tail again and the battery was gone and the switch was toast.

[hIKARInoob]

@djozz

@hIKARInoob

@djozz

Recently I accidentally shorted a high current LG cell (the dark brown one) and nothing spectacular happened: the internal fuse blew and that was that. I guess that will happen with two 30Q cells shorted in series.

How long did it take for the fuse to blow?

Seconds!

It happened inside a flashlight build. I closed the battery tube, clicked the switch and no light came out. Knowing that a direct battery short is always an option I immediately screwed off the tail again and the battery was gone and the switch was toast.

Too bad, but honestly this is a super nice feature. Accidental short is my biggest fear when it comes to lithium ion. Maybe you’ve read about the Acebeam K60 on CPF, and the Niwalker thrower with the electrical short in the carrier…

Do you know if all modern cells like GA, 30Q, and VTC6 are equipped with this internal fuse? How can you find out?

[djozz]

I think that I read in a HKJ article that all major brand 18650 batteries have a (non-resettable) internal fuse.

[hIKARInoob]

@djozz

I think that I read in a HKJ article that all major brand 18650 batteries have a (non-resettable) internal fuse.

Interesting.

You can find test data for the 30Q at NKON’s: https://www.nkon.nl/sk/k/30q.pdf (interesting torture tests)
On page 14/17 you can find the short circuit test: 10 milli Ohm is applied externally. It seems more is happening than just the fuse popping, as the temperature rises to 100 degrees C for over two minutes. So I’m a little bit puzzled what to expect…

[g_sintornillos]

@hIKARInoob

Do you know if all modern cells like GA, 30Q, and VTC6 are equipped with this internal fuse? How can you find out?

NCR18650GA: I believe the NCR series uses HRL technology instead of the internal fuse

HRL technology: http://business.panasonic.com/solutions-factoryassemblysolutions-featuresbenefits-batterytechnology

HRL technology in action: https://budgetlightforum.com/t/-/3132

[dchomak]

The almighty press guy just posted this on YouTube

Crushing Power Bank with Hydraulic Press | HUGE EXPLOSION!