Molicel p45b 21700


Video of test (not me)

Very promising, he uses them in his RC planes and says it'll kill Lipos

These cells are almost too good for most flashlights. In a wurkoss ts25 with temp calibrated and regulation set to step in at 55°C, from room temp straight to turbo I timed 15 seconds until ATR stepped in. 15 seconds lol. Temp gun was reading ~52°C around the head of the light at that time. I forced turbo back on just once right after the step down and the temp gun was reading over >70°C within 25 seconds, like anduril isn’t quite sure how to handle it. Probably overkill for most lights. But better overkill than too little I guess. Just be careful with turbo.

Too good for flashlights? Haha that's funny, no wonder I didn't see any posts on it. The specs seem incredible, as much of a game changer as the 30Q or VTC5 versus the other ones. Thanks for the turbo warning, his 8 cell config did 168 amps I believe, and he makes RC jets, not planes.

I’m sure there’s some posts about it. But more people probably use Samsung 30/40/50s or even the high drain lishens because they perform similar to the molicels at the amp draw levels that most flashlights use anyways and thr molicels are pricey.

I use them cuz I’m in Canada and all batteries are pricey up here anyways, I can’t scavenge 21700s, and the molicels are priced the same here as a 30q. Idk if it’s cuz Theyre a somewhat Canadian company so import duties would be lower, or if it’s just cuz there’s a bigger market for these cuz vapers use them alot. The flashlight battery market isn’t huge here because it’s illegal to sell any flashlights with a battery that isn’t built-in, proprietary, or protected. There’s still the idea that people are gonna kill themselves with them, so they banned.

But nobody cares what happens to vapers apparently lol

Impressive, 10C for a high capacity battery!

10 of these in a 20V power tool battery pack produces 1.6kW while providing very decent runtime.

Mooch’s testing notes from a year ago: Bench Test Results: Molicel P45B - 50A 4500mAh 21700

Still waiting on top grade cells: Rewrapped Molicel P45B and P28B at

@Jeffgoldblum, in what universe did you see flashlights being illegal to be sold with user removable non protected cells?

Are you kidding?

You know how when you buy an unprotected battery from Samsung or Sony or LG or any big manufacturer or look at the datasheet for one and theres always a warning statement along the lines of “This cell is unprotected and intended for use in protected battery packs only and NOT individually or as a standalone product. In order to operate this battery safely, it must have additional protection in the form of a PCB (protection circuit board) or BMS (battery management system), which is NOT included.” or how most Samsung cells these days literally say NEVER INSTALL, HANDLE OR CARRY right on them?

And then when you buy a flashlight from china itll say on the site or in the instruction manual “Use unprotected, flat top battery works only. Does not work with protected battery.”

That didn’t raise any red flags for you? Never stopped and thought…wait a second, i can’t do both of those at the same time. Samsung just prints those warnings for fun?

For manufacturers the labels are 100% to avoid liability and bad press, nothing else. They’re a direct consequence to the bad press from 2 years ago or something after some vapers got burning cells inside their pockets.

Those over-the-top messages on the Samsung wraps have only been around for a couple years now, maybe three, and were a direct result of vaping incidents (people misusing the cells….education). It’s just legal CYA, although they have always had a basic warning and always attempted to protect their sales avenues to try to restrict it to manufacturers. But between vaping and other battery incidents (including the few from Olight and the unrelated-but-related previous CR123 mishaps), the industry and thus the manufacturers are unfortunately moving more toward protected cells and/or proprietary cells with dummy-proof onboard charging and whatnot. All this is fine, if not a little irritating for enthusiasts that can understand and use li-ion cells safely, but I worry that at some point we may have a really difficult time obtaining stock cells…or that maybe we’ll have to unwrap, remove protection, and rewrap for our uses in some lights.

The spate of fires from hoverboards, bad battery bank designs, and lately e-bikes doesn’t help the situation.

@Jeffgoldblum, what do you think is in our battery chargers and flashlights?

All of these devices have proper battery management systems :slight_smile:


That might be the regulations in your country, I don’t know where that is, that’s not the case in Canada.

I imagine it’s certainly more of a “at your own risk” type deal in other places, USA included. I don’t know, I can’t speak to the laws of every country, but it definitely seems that is true for the US. That’s not the case in Canada. It’s seen as more of a ‘public safety’. We can’t have anything fun up here. Except legal weed and full nude strip clubs I guess.

There is an insane amount of documents and acts I would have to go through to cover all of the regulations on lithium ion batteries and li-ion battery powered devices in Canada. Maybe one night I’ll get on a desktop and try and make a fully sourced post about it, but rn I’m just on mobile so I’m just going to list a handful. If you want to look into it yourself some starting material I suggest with might include then Canadian Consumer Product Safety Act, The Hazardous Products Act, The Transportation of Dangerous Goods Act, especially the amendments Reporting Requirements and International Restrictions on Lithium Batteries, The Explosives Act, The Canadian Electric Code, and probably The Criminal Code of Canada isn’t a bad idea either.

I’ll cite a handful of quotes:

2.43.1 Lithium Cells and Batteries
(1) A person must not handle, offer for transport or transport lithium cells and batteries unless the cells and batteries meet the conditions set out in subsection (2): The conditions are as follows:

(a) the cell or battery type passes each test set out in subsection 38.3 of Part III of the Manual of Tests and Criteria;
(b) each cell or battery has a safety venting device or is designed to prevent a violent rupture under normal conditions of transport;
© each cell or battery is equipped to prevent external short circuits; and
(d) each battery containing cells or a series of cells connected in parallel is equipped with diodes, fuses or other devices that prevent dangerous reverse current flow.

Cells and batteries must be packed in inner packagings that completely enclose the cell or battery then
placed in a strong outer packaging.
— Cells and batteries must be protected so as to prevent short circuits. This includes protection against contact
with conductive materials within the same packaging that could lead to a short circuit.
— Each package must be capable of withstanding a 1.2 m drop test in any orientation without:
— damage to cells or batteries contained therein;
— shifting of the contents so as to allow battery to battery (or cell to cell) contact;
— release of contents.
And must be equipped with
an effective means of preventing accidental activation

No person shall manufacture, import, advertise or sell a consumer product that does not meet the requirements set out in the regulations.

No person shall advertise or sell a consumer product that they know

(a) is a danger to human health or safety;

(b) is the subject of a recall order made under section 31 or such an order that is reviewed under section 35 or is the subject of a voluntary recall in Canada because the product is a danger to human health or safety; or

© is the subject of a measure that has not been carried out but is required to be carried out under an order made under section 32 or such an order that is reviewed under section 35.

A person who contravenes a provision of this Act, oll a provision of the regulations or an order made under this Act is guilty of an offence and is liable

(a) on conviction on indictment, to a fine of not more than $5,000,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than two years or to both; or

(b) on summary conviction, for a first offence, to a fine of not more than $250,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months or to both and, for a subsequent offence, to a fine of not more than $500,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than 18 months or to both.

Not according to the Standards Council of Canada. They don’t even have temperature monitoring, and they must be sealed in tamper proof cases. Here’s a few other requirements

For cells or batteries contained in equipment:

3. Cells or batteries must be protected against short circuit and the dangerous evolution of heat by various
means, including, but not limited to:
a. individual protection of the battery terminals,
b. the use of inner packaging to prevent contact between cells and batteries,
c. batteries with recessed terminals designed to protect against short circuit,
d. the use of electrically non-conductive and non-combustible cushioning material to fill empty space
between the cells or batteries in the packaging
e. If metal packagings are used, they must be fitted with an electrically non-conductive lining material
(e.g., plastic).

There is way too many requirements to go into here. I’m not even getting into regulations that apply to flashlight specifically. Any flashlight advertised as self defense or that is bright enough to cause harm could be considered a prohibited weapon. Even attaching a flashlight to a legal weapon could make it a prohibited weapon, because you have no valid legal reason for doing that.

Different countries have different laws. They may be different than the ones in your country. My original post was only referencing my country

To me P45Bs don’t seem “revolutionary” compared to P42As, just “evolutionary” maybe.