【TS10 Max】TS10 Max available now on wurkkos brand day with dark blue oxidize

Commercial Sellers' Spot
81

Full agree. Also, most of us have 18650 and 21700, as well as probably some 14500 or 18350 already. I don’t have anything outside of those sizes, and I do not want to get yet another battery size. Especially not one that is already hard to source now, and probably almost impossible to source within a couple of years. Even 16340 and 26650/26800 I try to avoid, and those are easier to find than 16650.

In what regard? I trust a simple and well tested fully integrated battery charging chip way more than some custom microcontroller based solution in any bay charger. In fact, a TP4056 or similar I don’t even check with a DMM anymore. Any bay charger or RC charger gets checked with my Fluke. And a lot of them are pretty far off their target voltage. Even the big brand expensive ones.

According to koefs test, a 519A 5000K driven at 2A outputs ~600lm, so unless cooling is way undersized, 1800lm should indeed be no problem with 3S.

An efficient driver allows for the same burst performance, but it also allows for a way higher sustained performance. In a 26mm diameter light one can easily push the 519A to their limits with a boost, too (or rather, to the thermal limits of the host), while also offering hugely better sustained brightness than a cheaper driver could offer.

This is wrong. Unless a company sources a garbage receptacle because they cheap out, they are extremely long-lived. I’ve owned 2 phones since 2016, both for ~4 years each, and both were plugged at least once a day. When serving as a USB internet source for the notebook, or when charging just a little since I was in a hurry even multiple times a day. The ports of both are still perfect, and work as reliably as on day one. Same applies for my now 2 years old notebook.

And unlike a phone I charge most flashlights once a week at most, usually even less frequent since I alternate between lights and very rarely use an EDC type light for long enough to wear it down.

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82

i see people are so repelled by the 16650 idea because of sourcing problems…

  1. it’s 2024, it is easy to source ANYTHING ( i already posted the screenshot of the vapcell m20 google ad before)
  2. why is sourcing of stuff that you need a new piece of only once in every 5 year period such a problem anyway? do you eat those batteries?
  3. the battery will be sourced by the manufacturer anyway and sold to you inside the flashlight or even offered a spare one already so why would you even worry about sourcing it yourself locally? do you tend to forger where you put it?
  4. you will likely have just this flashlight running on such battery, you won’t need a new one for next few years, nor 5 spare ones as you all have plenty of other spare flashlights all over the place when emergency comes… why the anxiety?
  5. you don’t need a special recharger for it (just to rub in the humiliation of your laziness)

you guys are straight up creating and inflating a logistical problem that doesn’t even exist (and i’m the one who lives in countryside of eastern europe so unless you live in mainland africa, you don’t have harder sourcing of obscure stuff than me and i found a perfectly suitable new vapcell m20 for 5 bucks within 2s after opening my browser)

83

if noone likes the idea of making it a quad 519, nor it having a charging port, nor it being a 16650 host… it’s either doomed to be forever known as objectively worse kr4, less worthy of its name than kr4 (that’s really sad) OR it should be just another 14500 or maybe a double-14500 with a bit wider head filled with quad csp2323

84

I see lots of people bandy around the “efficient driver”. How much actual difference does it make, like percentage wise?

I thought he was talking about the rubber flap…??

I didn’t read it all but looks like some robust discussion. It seems the “let’s build s light” threads being out the passion :fire:

1 Thank
85

linear drivers can be as low as 50% efficient while buck/boost drivers can be as high as 95% efficient while FET drivers can be almost 99% efficient - tho the efficiency span is big across the outputs and battery voltage levels so sourcing a quality driver is quite a big deal in high output to low thermal mass ratio scenarios just like ts10

some flashlights are known to have poor engineering of their charging port cover flaps but it’s not a general rule and nowadays uncovered ip68 ports are becoming a thing, might have a problem with dust but so do phones and people have no problem living with it so really the only viable argument against the charging port is the fact some people like to charge their cells externally and see the port as an unnecessary expense (tho a very little one, max 1 buck difference to the manufacturer)

86

Same size as the FW3A
Lots of LED options (519A 5000K, a throwy LED like a Osram Boost HL, Luminus Sft25 or sft12, etc)
Swappable optic (compatible with Carclo 10xxx seris optics)
Regulated driver, like from the TS26S
Onboard USB C charging would be nice, but not required
Different colors (sand, grey, gold, green)
Simple UI with smooth and stepped ramping or to keep everyone happy, Anduril

1 Thank
87

yes, the ts10max has big shoes to fill so we better make sure it does as rn it’s not even close

im just an opinionated guy noone here likes so i don’t expect this to become anything more exciting, less mediocre than it is so far

which means there won’t be a reason for me to buy it even if i didn’t own a kr4 already

will end up being just an unworthy harvester of hype from it’s previous bestseller, exploiting their loyal customers, leaving them underwhelmed when they compare it to their much smaller ts10s with, to the eye, almost the same output

some of them, stubborn to protect their egos, will come up with pathetic justifications for buying it and trying to force themselves to be happy about their buy and using it first week but it will deteriorate and the mediocre flashlight will end up in the drawer anyway, they will get back to their ts10s and forget about it

i compared my ts10 with my kr4 both indoors and outdoors and those 3800lm are way closer to the 1400lm ts10 than i expected, i was left disappointed even tho i understood the logarithmic reception of light volume by eyes… i had to comfort myself that it’s at least more efficient and longer lasting at the same output levels… ended in a drawer anyway… not much use for it, once a month i have a situation that i know ts10 won’t be enough for

88

Really. Is this necessary? Anyone that does not share your ideas is stubborn and pathetic. No wonder you are so popular.

10 Thanks
89

it’s my prediction for the product performance on the market and i know over the years they tend to be more and more accurate as it’s part of my profession to monetise them

i knew the last bit would trigger those egoistic people, instantly finding themselves in that unspecific description, personalise it and make them realise their mentality, so look back if you think it was meant for you, because it wasn’t… i was thinking statistically in 100s of people - i always do and my ideas are developed with the goal to satisfy the biggest clientele range to create winning products and e-com brands

you might FEEL otherwise, but i’m not trying to selfishly enforce my preferences on the rest of the community… my goal is to help wurkkos make a product that as many people as possible will be interested in buying and if the things i objectively identified as plausible improvements to increase this product’s competitive advantage on the market are against your liking to the point you see them as me directly threatening your individuality (that you blatantly see as more important than helping the brand we have passion for to thrive on the market) then you are the selfish and egoistic one my friend…

read that twice before you continue

you’re trying to protect your individuality while i’m trying to help develop a product that will do as good in its category as the ts10 is doing in its one - which based on its current form and accessible information, it won’t since the kr4 exists - which is objectively a better performer with no less convenience and very likely the same price range eventually - which makes it a better value overall …you can’t just put your head to the sand and say it’s just my subjective opinion that i’m trying to enforce on someone… because it’s all in numbers… if you see objective truth as a threat, that’s on u

i’m a brand developer and marketing strategist so i don’t expect most people to be even remotely close to my way of thinking anyway, i’m just willing to help where i by chance see a flawed approach being taken and consult to improve for better when it comes to things i’m passionate about and pay attention to… - and especially when the brand specifically asks for such help

just because i use my personal experiences with products to practically argue my points doesn’t mean those points are meant to selfishly justify and enforce my subjective preferences

i seek truth, honesty and improvement, not popularity - if you thought i was trying to pitty myself for being unpopular, school years are behind us

i always look at the bigger picture and hurt feelings are seriously below me, nothing’s meant nor taken personal

now that you know i’m trying to make a more potent product, not to threaten your preferences, you might look back, analyse and come up with your ideas to actually improve the concept instead of impersonating the status quo at the expense of making a mediocre product worthy of it’s name less than the competition it’s supposed to beat to become the best-seller -which it still might initially purely because of the legacy of its name but that’s just a marketing exploit

90

You keep mentioning the KR4, so I wonder what your take is on the KR4 vs the FW3A?

91

good question, fw3a is in a grey zone, there isn’t any (that i know of) good tail e-swich 18650 size, anduril host thinner than 25mm - which is amazing and those turbo glow quirks are tempting and unique…

i know there is a market for it due to the sleek design, already mentioned advantages and it’s popular for modding but its not a shining a best-seller as it’s still within the kr4 category due to being an 18650 host…

many people who buy it, do so because they didn’t yet discover hanklights and lumintop is marketed on those mainstream sites like aliexpress and some compare it to the ts21 which is a bigger host with same output so they chose the fw3a more convincingly unless they want the charging port.

it’s gonna be close between the ts10max and fw3a tho fw3a has an established modding market and is even thinner compared to the kr4, basically just 1-2mm thicker than the 16650 host i proposed would likely be so the kr4 is a better performer while the fw3a is slightly better at what the ts10max is trying to acomplish

the ts10max won’t be exciting enough to completely overtake the fw3a demand so that’s another competitor it will have problem with especially when the ts10max is supposed to carry the hot rod legacy everyone will expect from it being the most prominent thing they love about their ts10s

ts10max is gonna be thicker than fw3a and weaker than kr4 - worst of both worlds, so what reason will there be for people to buy it being an inconvenient compromise between the two? (other than initial hype of course)

overall most people prefer the sheer output over shaving a couple mm in diameter but the girth difference between kr4 and fw3a is enough to justify its lower performance and keep its own demand

i don’t see the current form of ts10max bringing anything exciting enough on the table to steal the demand from any of the two, definitely more from the fw3a tho, kr4 being the better performer with similar sizing has stronger position on the market than fw3a for sure

i believe the few triumphs the ts10max could pull off is either to match the performance of the fw3a (almost 3000lm even with 519s so i back off the idea for keeping the efficacy high at 100lm/w) while being even thinner as a 16650 host (23-24mm max) beating the fw3a in the power to size and weight ratio, fulfil its hot rod legacy and take a lot of the demand from the fw3a while being too far from comparable to the kr4 and solidifying its market position

or

keeping it the size it is but making it a quad 519 instead of tripple and matching the performance of the kr4 at lower girth and possibly even price and if that is not enough, adding that nasty charging port for convenience bonus - for which things like ts25 always held their own against hanks D4 things

92

another unique quirk would be an rgb soft clicky like a sofirn pro swich

93

I haven’t measured my FW3A, but Lumintop’s site says it’s 25.5mm at the head and 92.5mm long.
Link

So the Max would only be 1.1mm wider at the head and the same length.

Unfortunately Lumintop has discontinued the entire FW series of lights.

I currently own 10 FW3A, I’ve owned 2 KR4 but I sold or traded both.
The KR4 is nice light but for me, it’s a little too bulky for EDC.

I’m in the minority here, I’ve owned 3 TS10.
I’ve sold 2 and currently only own a Brass one that just sits in it’s box on a shelf.
For me the TS10 is too small and slippery for my large hands.
I also find it aesthetically unpleasing.

If Wurkkos offers the Max in multiple CCTs, Flashing pads, multiple metals/anodizing colors and button that feels/works well, I think it will sell very well in the proposed format.

6 Thanks
94

So an inefficient driver (50%) will have just over half the runtime of 95% driver …?

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95

Also only half the sustained brightness because the wasted heat leads to the light getting hotter.

Once the battery is empty, a linear regulator gets very efficient, however. It’s only inefficient when the battery is full. To be as low as 50% the led would need a forward voltage of ~2V, however, which is something I have not seen yet.

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96

TS10 MAX方案汇总最终2 20240718
TS10 MAX方案汇总最终2 202407181920×959 79.2 KB

23 Thanks
97

Tailcap looks great, I still think the other clip looks better though :slight_smile:

Glad you went from 2 side to single side clip - I like single side a lot better for everything larger than 14500.

5 Thanks
98

These renderings look great, except for the clip. Personally, I would prefer the captive clip shown in a previous post. For me, the key features would be:

  • Triple-emitter 18650 light to remain fairly compact and pocketable
  • Choice of emitters, at least choice of CCT
  • Boost or buck/boost driver (ideally via collaboration with loneoceans or thefreeman)
  • Anduril2 version maintained in TK’s main repository
  • 3-pin flashing pads compatible with thefreeman and gchart flashing keys
  • AUX LEDs
  • Captive clip
  • Choice of colours and metals

Essentially, that’s the feature set of the good old FW3A (after modding), and if the FW3A wasn’t discontinued, I wouldn’t be particularly interested in such a TS10max.

However, since the FW3A is discontinued, I think an 18650 triple TS10max could be quite popular as it fills the gap in the market left behind.

If Wurkkos make a few additional design choices for modders, then I’d be delighted:

  • No glue - neither bezel nor driver, tailcap not so important
  • Easy to dismantle and put back together
  • Optic / MCPCB compatible with Carclo 105xx optics

If they get that right, then I can imagine a modding community growing around the light.

8 Thanks
99

Love the new renders. I like the slip-on one-way clip.

However, the tip of the clip needs to angle away from the flashlight. The tip of the clip in your render looks almost flush with the head. This makes it impossible to hook the clip onto anything without using 2 hands: one to open the clip and the other to hold the flashlight.

A good flashlight clip should only need 1 hand to slip onto a pocket. It should never be necessary to use your other hand to open the clip.

Also, a deep-carry clip option would be nice (where the back-bend of the clip is near the bottom of the tail).

3 Thanks
100

Is there a thread that explains this efficiency thing?

From what i understand 519 has vf 3.7v at 2amps…? If that’s somewhat correct then I don’t know the calculation to get 50% from a driver…??