Uniquefire UF-1405 - A worthy zoomy?

[cajampa]

Wouldn’t a cheaper option be to get a bunch of the fasttech 67mm aspheric lenses, i assume they are the same as the Uniquefire’s.
And to send them to be coated & then send them out, because shipping the original lenses to the US to be coated & back would be more expensive i think.

Anyway i wish i could afford to spend $175 to get a boost to ~750kcd in my 1504 but i can’t.

And if i had $200 to get a light in the 750-775kcd+ range now, i would actually get the ridiculous looking but amazingly throwing Eagle Tac M25C2 Turbo, with a XP-G2 S4 that can do 775kcd

But i am into this to get max performance for as little cost as possible, so my next mod/build i am interested in the 750kcd+ range, is the Coroui D01 with the 86mm kaidomain reflector mod
FmC got to 625kcd with the old R5 XP-G2, with the new S4 it could possibly even break in to the 800kcd range If i am not miscalculation something that is

I think i could build it for about $70

Coroui D01 $28
86mm reflector $19
XP-G2 S4 $4
Various lens hoods about ~$15
Copper mcpcb 32mm, maxtoch or noctigon $4
switches & wires i already have no driver for max performance

But i sincerely hope you get 30 to commit MEM, because it think it is a very interesting mod to the 1504/1405 platform. But i am not sure if we have 30 here who can mod the light to max lux performance AND who can & want to spend $175 to get to 750kcd.
But post about it in the 1504 GB thread & start a GB thread to gather interests.

I am still very interested in the MEM J20, because that is a performance range i can’t build myself, it looks great in the pictures & not as long as i thought it would be compared to the 1504.

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

My initial work with the collars is mostly in the 1504 group buy thread I think. I’ve been cautious about throwing out dimensions and such, partially because it’s basic geometry, and partly to stay under the radar. The waiven patents basically make any RA a potential legal liability, and I can’t afford to go to court for something that actually loses me money on my time (they take longer to make than what I charge is worth when I’ve put them on a light).

[luminarium_iaculator]

Oh don't be afraid... Your part does not look like that and you can declare it as car part/kitchen accessory or something else. They can't sew you for that. So I think you can send that to Cajampa without any legal consequences :)

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

They’re patent basically covers anything that reflects light back onto the LED surface to increase its output. It’s so broad it limits anyone developing anything even remotely similar.

[scianiac]

Until someone copies it in China, where copyrights aren’t always exactly enforced. As you say it’s a fairly simple device and I pretty much know exactly how to make it, really the hardest part will be getting the exit aperture just the right size. I’ll look over the GB thread some more, just was wondering if you had thought of anything different machining wise. I can understand your reluctance on copyright issues but from my understanding there is nothing wrong with freely sharing information on how to build one yourself. What is most annoying about this is if they just sold the rings for a reasonable price they probably could sell tons of them and make more money than they do selling to the very select applications where it’s cost can be justified. Unless there is some application I’m unaware of.

[MEM]

There is a lot of misconception with RA building.

First of all the metal that is chosen is why there is a big barrier at whatever percentage you guys seem to be stopping at. The barrier will insist you stay right where you are no matter how well you polish and sharpen that mirror image, because the metal is going to keep the photons it steals from the wavelength region you need them from.

RA size is to work out with the LED just like lens size. The same lens theory applies as to mirror surfaces here, you are just changing (overlapping) the ray trace direction in the model. So, some basic lens/reflector theory would be: consistency as applied to a hemisphere.

Think of stamping production, if a metal is to be used as the host mirror substance to be coated with reflector material. I.E. If a hemisphere with a 50mm radius is stamped in a pattern, and its true center can be up to 0.5mm off-center once stamped in the mold, we see that this is a 0.5% shift in spherical center vs reflective diameter. If a much smaller RA size is used, let’s say 10mm radius, and the host material shifts the same amount of 0.5mm in the metal press, the end product is 2.5% off from true center. This is a small example of how size plays out. Once “quality” or “optical grade” is reached in the component, you can see how size starts to play a smaller role as far as surface consistency is concerned. However, as the die is a real object, its maximum dimensions must be considered around focal length of the RA. Since a die corner is at a different distance than the die center is from the RA surface, for rays to land on those two areas, two different focal lengths are being used. As the RA becomes larger, the difference in focal lengths between two die points also diminishes as a percentage of absolute focal length. Since focal length is very important to land on, this presents significance in some situations where larger RAs are better to use.

Reflective surface shape is not hard to achieve at all—reflection of all LED wavelengths is what is hard to achieve. Silver doesn’t do this right, gold doesn’t do this right, aluminum (and oxides) can work indeed well, but still do not do this best for LED spectrum blue light. To tell about reflective coatings (as some people have PM’d me regarding the subject); the truth is that a typical or standard mirror coating is not what is wanted. Most standard coatings absorb too much high-energy colors in the blue spectrum (or other colors —how hot is your aperture?). A special mixture that is applied by vacuum deposition, to reflect specific wavelengths, is what my original RA design achieves the highest output numbers with, and is what I will be making more of. It’s also the design Wavicopyen started selling after I emailed it to them near 2007 to produce. lol

I’m not 3D printing my RAs to clear up any confusion there, though I would gladly print you some hemispheres you can attempt to hone. I am 3D printing their stages to mount on. I am trying to get an acrylic version run coated with a good reflector material, which isn’t cheap, and those will likely be “the ones”.

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

Trigonometry will give you the opening size, just remember that you need to calculate from the edges of the emitter surface to the edge of your hemisphere/parabola.

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

@MEM

There is a lot of misconception with RA building.

First of all the metal that is chosen is why there is a big barrier at whatever percentage you guys seem to be stopping at. The barrier will insist you stay right where you are no matter how well you polish and sharpen that mirror image, because the metal is going to keep the photons it steals from the wavelength region you need them from.

RA size is to work out with the LED just like lens size. The same lens theory applies as to mirror surfaces here, you are just changing (overlapping) the ray trace direction in the model. So, some basic lens/reflector theory would be: consistency as applied to a hemisphere.

Think of stamping production, if a metal is to be used as the host mirror substance to be coated with reflector material. I.E. If a hemisphere with a 50mm radius is stamped in a pattern, and its true center can be up to 0.5mm off-center once stamped in the mold, we see that this is a 1% shift in spherical center vs reflective diameter. If a much smaller RA size is used, let’s say 10mm radius, and the host material shifts the same amount of 0.5mm in the metal press, the end product is 2.5% off from true center. This is a small example of how size plays out. Once “quality” or “optical grade” is reached in the component, you can see how size starts to play a smaller role as far as surface consistency is concerned. However, as the die is a real object, its maximum dimensions must be considered around focal length of the RA. Since a die corner is at a different distance than the die center is from the RA surface, for rays to land on those two areas, two different focal lengths are being used. As the RA becomes larger, the difference in focal lengths between two die points also diminishes as a percentage of absolute focal length. Since focal length is very important to land on, this presents significance in some situations where larger RAs are better to use.

Reflective surface shape is not hard to achieve at all—reflection of all LED wavelengths is what is hard to achieve. Silver doesn’t do this right, gold doesn’t do this right, aluminum (and oxides) can work indeed well, but still do not do this best for LED spectrum blue light. To tell about reflective coatings (as some people have PM’d me regarding the subject); the truth is that a typical or standard mirror coating is not what is wanted. Most standard coatings absorb too much high-energy colors in the blue spectrum (or other colors —how hot is your aperture?). A special mixture that is applied by vacuum deposition, to reflect specific wavelengths, is what my original RA design achieves the highest output numbers with, and is what I will be making more of. It’s also the design Wavicopyen started selling after I emailed it to them near 2007 to produce. lol

I’m not 3D printing my RAs to clear up any confusion there, though I would gladly print you some hemispheres you can attempt to hone. I am 3D printing their stages to mount on. I am trying to get an acrylic version run coated with a good reflector material, which isn’t cheap, and those will likely be “the ones”.

So you’re saying the limitation to the collars I’ve done in stainless steel is down to it not being a reflective enough material and limitations on perfectly focusing such a small collar then? If I made a dozen or so from aluminum what would it likely cost to have them coated with the depositions you recommend?

[cajampa]

What are you saying that LOL Wavicopyen stole your idea/design/formula for the RA’s reflective surfaces, and they are using it now

At least that should make you 100% safe from them coming after you, with their ridiculous broad patent on reflective surfaces.

[luminarium_iaculator]

.................................................................

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

@luminarium iaculator

Exactly… It can be sold as egg holder.

I would not afraid of sending this to any part of the world. Even to Waviencopyen thieves.

The ones I’ve made would have to be sold as jellybean holders, they’re tiny. Unfortunately there’s an awful lot of evidence here on the forum already that shows an intent to sell a product knowing that it is likely to be used in a manner that violates the patent. What would be awesome is if MEM had some proof that his communication predated their patent and was able to make them allow him the ability to authorize specific third parties to produce, develope, and improve the technology.

[hank]

> emailed it to them near 2007

Curiously, their patent 7976204 was Filed: June 13, 2007

[cajampa]

I am sure us jokesters could clean up any reference by deleting a few posts if needed

[luminarium_iaculator]

And contact by PM is the most private thing. No one should sew you for selling diy stuff to your forum friends.

[MEM]

Hehe guys, thanks for the laugh. Not a day goes by that I do not want to tear out my eyes from their sockets because of wavicopyen. I am not going to disclose info on this as I have pending licensing of my own on a new RA design that works far better than my first design. However, a rundown of a theoretical scenario could take place. Just imagine a story long long ago in a galaxy far far near. Note anything you find odd in this whacky tale… You made something you could not find or see anywhere ever in existence that cost many hundreds of $ to have prototypes made. You knew that it worked, so you attempted to find a licensing company for months when your patent luck seemed to run dry due to funding. You knew it was something that worked, to you—it was great, but you sometimes questioned yourself whether anyone would actually use it in reality. Once you were finally referred over to a licensing company, while having first working prototypes in hand, communication is normal, then literally becomes “doors slammed in your face” with the new licensing company, but only once your data was forwarded to the company—meaning that company now has the simple blueprints to your simple design. There were claims immediately against the real creator of the item, then communication was closed by the licensing company. There was nothing back then. RA, etc, ha…right. People were going nuts about the weakest LEDs then. It was a product that simply didn’t exist, except for in a mans garage in the USA who knew he had something special, but sometimes this man questioned his idea of what special really was. His biggest mistake in hindsight, was questioning anything at all.

…But ya gotta, gotta keep movin’. There’s more light, to make.

Now that I got that out, back on subject.

KKW, using pressed “utensils” from SS will result in high kelvin shift and low lux gain as only yellows/reds are mainly reflected and additional stimulation from blue light is greatly cut. People are likely stopping at 20, because SS cuts 455nm light off at about 25 average.

Have a look:

(Source: Photonicsforenergy.org)

KKW also, making from aluminum will help, make sure once finish is specular, immediately protect them with padding and then vacuum seal them in Zip-Lock pump-dry bags—they are cheap if you have no other vacuum sealer.

—I will contact you via PM on this shortly, getting into some specifics.

For others, noting that 750kcd may cost you some money, that is a very low, conservative estimate on output. LEDs are evolving. Surface intensity is increasing. To get 1 million cd, would not be much of a real challenge when done properly. Soon right when you find you have 1 million cd potential, it’s going to be easy to slap something together with 3.5 million cd. Cost is always going to be your only limitation. Big gains will not be cheap because all parts need to represent real quality if the design is to stay smaller. That is something that isn’t always budget, unfortunately.

[MEM]

Also.

If anyone is in consideration of what has been proposed recently; and more anonymity you seek, for whatever your reasons are…

Then make note of something like “post edited for clarity” within about 12 hours from now as I will do, and delete whatever you wish to clean up, like the egg holders or anything else. Problem solved.

Now we do this as fellow friends and machinists behind closed curtains ( 0:) ), collaborating to bring you the very best BLF egg-holders anyone will ever need.

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

@MEM

Hehe guys, thanks for the laugh. Not a day goes by that I do not want to tear out my eyes from their sockets because of wavicopyen. I am not going to disclose info on this as I have pending licensing of my own on a new RA design that works far better than my first design. However, a rundown of a theoretical scenario could take place. Just imagine a story long long ago in a galaxy far far near. Note anything you find odd in this whacky tale… You made something you could not find or see anywhere ever in existence that cost many hundreds of $ to have prototypes made. You knew that it worked, so you attempted to find a licensing company for months when your patent luck seemed to run dry due to funding. You knew it was something that worked, to you—it was great, but you sometimes questioned yourself whether anyone would actually use it in reality. Once you were finally referred over to a licensing company, while having first working prototypes in hand, communication is normal, then literally becomes “doors slammed in your face” with the new licensing company, but only once your data was forwarded to the company—meaning that company now has the simple blueprints to your simple design. There were claims immediately against the real creator of the item, then communication was closed by the licensing company. There was nothing back then. RA, etc, ha…right. People were going nuts about the weakest LEDs then. It was a product that simply didn’t exist, except for in a mans garage in the USA who knew he had something special, but sometimes this man questioned his idea of what special really was. His biggest mistake in hindsight, was questioning anything at all.

…But ya gotta, gotta keep movin’. There’s more light, to make.

Now that I got that out, back on subject.

KKW, using pressed “utensils” from SS will result in high kelvin shift and low lux gain as only yellows/reds are mainly reflected and additional stimulation from blue light is greatly cut. People are likely stopping at 20, because SS cuts 455nm light off at about 25 average.

Have a look:

(Source: Photonicsforenergy.org)

KKW also, making from aluminum will help, make sure once finish is specular, immediately protect them with padding and then vacuum seal them in Zip-Lock pump-dry bags—they are cheap if you have no other vacuum sealer.

—I will contact you via PM on this shortly, getting into some specifics.

For others, noting that 750kcd may cost you some money, that is a very low, conservative estimate on output. LEDs are evolving. Surface intensity is increasing. To get 1 million cd, would not be much of a real challenge when done properly. Soon right when you find you have 1 million cd potential, it’s going to be easy to slap something together with 3.5 million cd. Cost is always going to be your only limitation. Big gains will not be cheap because all parts need to represent real quality if the design is to stay smaller. That is something that isn’t always budget, unfortunately.

That’s both an enlightening post, and graph. If the blue reflectivity of metals varies so much then I suspect the specific alloy will matter too. I did some looking and aluminum really is the best material for this application with over 3x the reflectance in the blue region, too bad it oxidizes unless it’s coated.

[cajampa]

Ok, i try to find my posts with referenses to this & “clean” it up.
EDIT this thread is done on my posts i think anyway.

If anyone know of any of my posts that could benefit to a bit of scrubbing, please let me know. So we can get some beautiful & shiny jellybean holders done in the future

And MEM that is a really unfortunate story, i am sorry you had to go through that.

[luminarium_iaculator]

Kloeper Knife Works really has great idea but MEM is original inventor of this.

MEM consider option 4 small jelly bean holder which you can easy send worldwide. Plug and play is what most people want.

That can be used in smaller versions of this light(which will be more in use by hunters and more hunter friendly than 1504 ).

[Kloepper_Knife_Works]

The only thing I’ve done is decide that I like a small collar from the standpoint of it fitting any light. I doubt that was even an original idea. I want to improve on the performance of the ones I’ve made though, and I like the science that is involved, but as far as me coming up with any new original ideas for the collars, not yet.