Prototype 3 arriving 7 of 7 now!! The Q8, a BLF premium edition SRK type monster flashlight

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djozz
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Flintrock wrote:

SawMaster wrote:
OK so far though the tint could be an issue for some.

 


I can’t see how anyone appreciates extra brightness when it’s mostly just in that blue peak.  Unless it’s for a disco party, no thanks, but there’s something for everyone I guess.  Nothing $20 worth led’s won’t solve, oh wait, that’s half the price of the light.  Anyway, it’s not like they can’t ship it with different leds.


This is a first prototype and they used cool white leds for it, and many other parts that should and will be different in the end product, everything to discuss, but nothing to worry about at this point. (will save my worries for the final sample Wink )
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Tom E wrote:
Hopefully they will do the bypass’s because a bypass is more effective than double springs. The new Convoy L6, for example, comes with bypass’s. Even if they used thin wires, like 24 or 26 AWG, it’s a good improvement, and I think still better than double springs, but also depends on the type of spring or spring quality.

As a flashlight manufacturer I wouldn’t bypass springs. There is a big risk the bypass gets teared off, as it happened in my L6 after a few days. Most people here can easily do bypasses, and non flashoholics won’t mind the litttle difference in output.
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I replaced the bypass's in my L6 - very thin, not well soldered - poor quality. Did not have problems with them torn off though, or any bypass I've done with silicone covered wires, and I've done hundreds at this point.

We thought the double springs would be easier, maybe cheaper, like in the Mankers. That's why we spec'ed them.

djozz
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As I understand that without double springs or bypasses, the Q8 protoype puts out well over 5000 lumen, I would like to leave both out to have the springs as proven effective fuses. Modders living a bit closer to the edge will have soldered them in in 20 minutes.

Flashy Mike
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Tom E wrote:

I replaced the bypass’s in my L6 – very thin, not well soldered – poor quality. Did not have problems with them torn off though, or any bypass I’ve done with silicone covered wires, and I’ve done hundreds at this point.


We thought the double springs would be easier, maybe cheaper, like in the Mankers. That’s why we spec’ed them.

There are workers doing this bypasses manually, some are skilled, some not. The Q8 even needs 4 bypasses. Just a question of minimizing warranty problems.
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djozz wrote:
As I understand that without double springs or bypasses, the Q8 protoype puts out well over 5000 lumen, I would like to leave both out to have the springs as proven effective fuses. Modders living a bit closer to the edge will have soldered them in in 20 minutes.

This is my thinking as well. I see no reason to demand they bypass the springs as long as they can handle the current, even if run with a single cell (if that option is going to be advertised with the light). If the springs do not melt in these conditions then I would just leave them alone.

From a manufacturing perspective double springs is the easier and cheaper option as well. That can simple be reflowed onto the PCB and needs no manual labor / skill.

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Flintrock wrote:

SawMaster wrote:
OK so far though the tint could be an issue for some.

I can’t see how anyone appreciates extra brightness when it’s mostly just in that blue peak.  Unless it’s for a disco party, no thanks, but there’s something for everyone I guess.  Nothing $20 worth led’s won’t solve, oh wait, that’s half the price of the light.  Anyway, it’s not like they can’t ship it with different leds.

Yeah, not that it’s likely to happen but I’d pay 10-15$ more to get it with the new 90CRI 219C Smile
Alux
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How about that? Enhanced Beryllium Copper Battery Springs

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Alux wrote:
How about that? *Enhanced Beryllium Copper Battery Springs*

In the OP we called for "Double springs with the smaller being Phosphor Bronze springs". I'm thinking we should stay with this approach - this was decided on way back.

Yep, I'm emailing a whole bunch this morn with our manufacturer contact about the prototype and where to go from here. There were a bunch of things done he wasn't aware, and was out of his control then. He just wanted to get the proto out to us in a rush as-is, and realizes there's a bunch of shortcomings. Things have changed over there since, so it seem we have a much better line of communication right now. If nothing else, this prototype has kicked this off -- all good.

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Tom E wrote:

Alux wrote:
How about that? *Enhanced Beryllium Copper Battery Springs*

In the OP we called for "Double springs with the smaller being Phosphor Bronze springs". I'm thinking we should stay with this approach - this was decided on way back.

Yep, I'm emailing a whole bunch this morn with our manufacturer contact about the prototype and where to go from here. There were a bunch of things done he wasn't aware, and was out of his control then. He just wanted to get the proto out to us in a rush as-is, and realizes there's a bunch of shortcomings. Things have changed over there since, so it seem we have a much better line of communication right now. If nothing else, this prototype has kicked this off -- all good.

 

Sounds like a really good situation, not the details changing of course, but more importantly the unerstanding and interest to deal with it.

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Phosphor Bronze is also good!

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Please add me again to the list for another light. Thank you…….Jesse

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*

The Miller
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And OP list updated!
Wow what a huge number
I have yet to post the pics of the prototype on CPF, I think it will be ore then 18 when done Wink

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Please add me to the list!

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Hi,

My name is Keith, and I’m a flashlight addict.

Please add my name to the list.

Wink

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The Miller wrote:
And OP list updated! Wow what a huge number I have yet to post the pics of the prototype on CPF, I think it will be ore then 18 when done Wink

We’ll forgive you if you forget

G’day!

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You can add me to the list !!

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Please add me to the list!

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The Miller wrote:
And OP list updated! Wow what a huge number

750+ Woaw Woaaaaw Waaaaaarg g g!
Good job The Miller! Beer

I hope the very noticeable interest in this project and the SRK style flashlight type will help motivate a better then decent manufacturing process and put it back into the glorious position it used to sit.

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I just think that when the final light is ready to go this GB will set a record for selling 1,000 lights.

Everything about this light along with the price makes it a “Must Have”

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Add me to the list please….the madness continues. Thank you to all the people who make these flashlights a reality!

The Miller
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velocraig wrote:
*

???

joeangi welcome to BLF!

OP updated

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Couple of new videos, showing the new ThorFire BLF.

 

This shows the basic operation of Narsil v1.2 on the new ThorFire BLF Q8 prototype:

 

 

This shows wall beamshot comparisons between the ThorFire BLF Q8 on the left, and the 4X SRK clone, modified, on the right, both running Narsil v1.2:

The Miller
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Hey you mentioned it in an email but yeah that Q8 prototype reflector gives a very pretty beam
I think I like it more then the srk beam profile.

Tom E
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The Miller wrote:
Hey you mentioned it in an email but yeah that Q8 prototype reflector gives a very pretty beam I think I like it more then the srk beam profile.

Yep, totally agree. It appears to be a tight beam for a flood light, but overall much better looking pattern than the SRK clone. I have to do some comparisons to better make a judgment on the width of the beam - will know better tonight. I though a video would show the differences much better than still shots.

I'm in the process of writing up a detailed post now on the prototype.

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I like the SRK beam better myself, it appears to be a tighter hotspot. The rose peddle design is something that doesn’t bother me when actually using it outside.

Have you done a lux comparison?

The Second Amendment is in place in case the politicians ignore the others.

Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. -- Frederic Bastiat , French economist(1801-1850)

Texas Avenger Driver Series

My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT

How I made a True integrating PVC sphere with no math involved

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I like the slightly larger hot spot of the Q8, as well as the absence of petals, whether rosy or not. Wink

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More tech details on the ThorFire BLF Q8 prototype

After taking some pictures and measurements, it was time to tear her down and found some interesting things. We are cautioning everyone not to rush to judgment. This is the first prototype and has several issues that will be addressed.

  • Has a real nice one piece DTP copper MCPCB, maybe a little on the thin side at 1.24mm thick, but nice 35.8mm diameter
  • the LED shelf is a solid 7.05mm thick and integrated with the head, but has an oversized center hole of 15.5mm
  • outer dimensions are dead-on with standard SRK's at 59.0mm head, 50.0 mm tube, 52.0mm at tailcap, 135.1mm length
  • LED wires are just two and are heavy gauge of 18 AWG - this is as we requested, and probably a good part of why it performs so well
  • driver was a surprise - they used our design, parts list, and firmware as a model to clone. So, they used a different MCU and FET. but still a FET+1 7135. This is not acceptable, and explains the issues I noticed in the operation of ramping, etc. We are working with them again to review our driver proposal.
  • it has an operational Indicator LED under the switch cover - we did not expect this and not sure if it will stay in the production run (but I do like it!)

So we had some good news, some bad news. There's been some re-org with the engineering team at ThorFire, so think we got a good foundation to continue with, and hoping the electronics is not as issue (may have been cost and availability of parts, not sure).

So we decided to swap out the ThorFire driver and install one of our own OSHPark drivers to better match up with the eventual production run. here' some pics:

Stock proto ThorFire driver, a bit messy:

Cleaned up:

The LED's/MCPCB:

Reflector base, showing the cutout for the wiring. Alignment pieces appear to be glued in and beat up - again, we are asking to get this fixed up because the LED's aren't properly being centered - alignment pieces are a little over sized:

Nice brass retaining ring for the driver:

The top stack: Bezel, glass and o-ring:

Tail PCB w/springs. PCB has wide traces on both sides which is good for lowering resistance, but those springs gotta go - hopefully better quality double springs will be used:

Just to show, the one cell is held in place well, so no problem running the light on 1 cell, up to all 4:

Showing the real copper of the MCPCB:

18 AWG wires:

Shelf the MCPCB sits on, all cleaned up (anodized, oversized hole that can be much smaller):

Closeup on the reflector:

Brass ring removed:

Cleaned up, and reflowed to the OSHPark driver using high temp hot air station:

The "real" BLF Q8 driver goin in smile:

I left in the LED's the prototype came with, though they are CW XPL's - should be NW 3D's. I'll be swapping in V6 3D's next, after this.

 

Good news after the driver swap, lumens at 30 secs bumped up from 5,320 to 5,624 - 5.7% gain

Could be within a margin of error, but made sure I used the same 30Q cells slightly lower @4.19V.

Also I found out the body threads match to other SRK clones I got (2 I tried), so I could swap in the spring bypassed battery tube base, and measured on the same slightly depleted cells: 6,018 lumens @30 secs, so another 7% bump, even with the cells at 4.15V.

I also measured parasitic drain on this new setup:

  - with Indicator switch LED on: 0.22 mA, so 1 Ah drain in 6 months

  - with indicator switch LED off (in lockout for example): 0.037 mA, so 1 Ah drain in about 3 years

Basically, even with the indicator LED on 24/7, it would take 6 years to fully drain a set of 3000 mAh cells, and the GREEN switch LED is pretty bright. Again though, can't guarantee the final version will have the LED installed.

 

 

 

The Miller
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Thanks for this great update Tom!

Yep there is still work to be done and Thorfire is very responsive, so for now we thnk th work can and shall be done.
Woowzers on the 6K lumens, 50% above specification, how is that Big Smile

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