Coronavirus discussion thread

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sb56637
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Muto wrote:
Number of cases of CV-19 in U.S. as of this writing = 85,435 (Reported and Known)

vs how many tested?

>552,000 according to this.

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To say people are “overreacting” is subjective. Afterwords if the overreaction works, some say “see! it was all for nothing” when it may well have been the overreaction that helped slow it down, or if it got bad and everything got snowed under “how could you not see this coming?” A guy in NYC who carries around garlic to fend off cougar attacks,“but there has not been a cougar attack here in 100 years” “See how well it works”

Or the guy who carries a bomb with him every time he flies “The odds of there being a bomb on a plane are very low, the odds of there being 2 bombs on a plane are pretty much zero”

Or the piece of emergency equipment that never gets used, because like all emergency equipment, you don’t need it al all, right up until the point you need it really badly

I point to others in this group to justify how many flashlights I have.

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I like the way you think.

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Just like y2k. Was it going to be a non-issue? Or was the hysteria what kept everything from going boom?

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Seeing this should probably be mandatory!!!

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hank wrote:
Quote:
"care for the dying with opiates and sleeping pills", write the staff of the German Institute for Disaster Medicine in Tübingen in the report, which is available to the German press agency.
I can't find a first-hand source for this story, only sites like this one: https://www.tellerreport.com/news/2020-03-26---corona-crisis-in-france--... Does anyone know the actual source?

 

Sorry, I forgot to include the link. It’s a German news website but deepl.com or Google Translate might be able to translate it into English.

https://www.n-tv.de/panorama/Uber-80-Jaehrige-werden-nicht-mehr-beatmet-...

“Everyone, deep in their hearts, is waiting for the end of the world to come.” (Haruki Murakami, 1Q84)

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Apparently this is not true.

(in french) https://www.dna.fr/edition-strasbourg/2020/03/26/les-contre-verites-alle...
(google translated in German) https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=fr&tl=de&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.d...
(and in english) https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.d...

Lux-Perpetua wrote:

And some really depressing news from Alsace, France (close to the German border):


Disaster physicians have gained an impression of the situation in Strasbourg – and report on dramatic conditions on the border with Germany. According to the report, infected doctors at the University Hospital in Strasbourg continue to work with corona patients and people over 80 are no longer ventilated. Instead, they are “assisted in dying with opiates and sleeping pills”, write the staff of the German Institute for Disaster Medicine in Tübingen in the report.

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On Dutch TV there were reports that the situation around Strasbourg is very serious.
And it might happen there are two patients and only one bed avaiable at a certain moment.
But I have heard nothing (yet) about palliative treatment.
IF it happens, nobody will tell, because any form of euthanasia is a big NON in France.

What I did hear and see on TV is the French use the TGV (French bullet-train) to transfer IC-patients from Strasbourg to hospitals that are less over stressed. Same happens in NL, but we use ambulances and rescue helicopters.

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I dunno what up with people sometimes. I work in a Namco arcade, and literally returned to work for the summer season 2 weeks ago. In the first few days, the whole complex had guidelines as did guests.

I could see within a day or so, NO ONE was going to follow the guidelines – for our arcade we had 1, yes 1 bottle of spray cleaner supplied and were expected to clean all machine buttons and touch points hourly……right. In a huge arcade…. that 1 bottle lasted less than 1 day and we were back to regular ‘non covid’ cleaner, and it couldn’t have been done hourly simply because there is 1 member of staff working on the floor in the day, and obviously they do other things like look after guests and machines!
Then the complex, similar guidelines – hourly cleans – they happened every 8 hours instead and again with not useful cleaner. I even said to 1 cleaner – ‘shouldn’t you be cleaning those handrails more often?’ to which he shrugged his shoulders…..
Then the guests, all walking around like nothing wrong with swarms of snotty kids, no distancing etc, coughing and sneezing……children licking machines…omg. Worse still, all the guests come from all over the UK and mainly cities – bringing these people down on holiday to rural unaffected areas was a HUGE mistake.
I took the decision 2 days later to self isolate (risking my pay, although it’s sorted for the time being) – I could see no one was taking things seriously – my son has a weakened immune system so I went home, and I have stayed there and have been since.
A week later the camp shut and 3 staff members had it – I don’t know how many have it now. Too late.

The whole reaction is pitiful, as is the advice. That said, you can have top notch advice/procedures but if idiots don’t follow it………
I went shopping yesterday, and if I HAVE to go out to a very public place like a shop, then and only then I wear a mask – the looks I got! anyone would think I was the stupid one! when talking to the checkout girl (no mask at all) she said how sad she was not being ‘allowed’ to wear a mask even if she wanted to (and she did) , as it might freak out customers! WTF! nice one ALDI!
I don’t use a regular one btw – mine (although I already owned it) is apparently ‘surgeon grade’ Shocked
GVS P3

The biggest mistake was to compare it to flu in respect to making people not take it seriously enough. Yes, flu kills more people – but it does not spread so quickly and so thoroughly as covid, nowhere near and also doesn’t seem to infect so many – I know people who have rarely if ever caught flu, but they have this! because it infects more people, it has more chance to kill/be serious.
Personally I think in the end it will eclipse any individual yearly flu figures.. but that is a long time away yet.

Muto
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slmjim wrote:

Perspective:


Population of U.S. = 327,200,000


Number of cases of CV-19 in U.S. as of this writing = 85,435


Percentage of U.S. population infected with CV-19 = 0.03%


 


slmjim


 


 

OK,
Now how about percentage of people tested who were positive?

U.S. Cases tested 552,000 with 85,435 positive = .15477 %

“History doesn’t repeat itself, but it sometimes rhymes,” Mark Twain

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sb56637
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Muto wrote:
slmjim wrote:

Perspective:


Population of U.S. = 327,200,000


Number of cases of CV-19 in U.S. as of this writing = 85,435


Percentage of U.S. population infected with CV-19 = 0.03%


 


slmjim


 


 

OK,
Now how about percentage of people tested who were positive?

U.S. Cases tested 552,000 with 85,435 positive = .15477 %

Just have to move the decimal place: 15.477%

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Muto
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Thanks!

Can you do that with my checking account too please Smile

“History doesn’t repeat itself, but it sometimes rhymes,” Mark Twain

After the Apocalypse there will be only 2 things left alive, Cockroaches and Keith Richards
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Joshk wrote:
Anyone else on here have a slight upper-respiratory infection?
Last Saturday I had a touch of dry/soar throat. By Sunday it was a runny nose. And since Tuesday it’s been mild congestion.
I cough a few times per day, but I think it’s still left over from the flu I had 3 weeks ago.
I just read this and it sounds similar, except I haven’t noticed a fever of any kind on me.
If this is what some mild cases of Covid are like, then there are SO many people not even noticing they have it because it doesn’t match what’s being reported as “mild”.
What I am saying is what-if there are 3 types of cases, not just 2? “Meek”, “Mild”, and “Severe”.

So how about you? Anyone have slight upper-respiratory issues they think are too meek to be Covid?


Yes, since fall I have had a upper respiratory thing going on. A cold that won’t completely go away. Lots of people were complaining of the same.
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I keep reading from many posters that this is no worse than the flu based upon the fact that so many Americans die of the flu each year. There are a couple of differences. We don’t really know a lot about the CV-19 because it has only been around for a short period of time. It seems to be transmitted more easily than the flu which means eventually we will have a lot of cases. We have a yearly immunization for flu and at least some treatments (Tamiflu) to lessen the severity. We have NO immunization and no proven ways to mitigate the effects in serious cases. In some cases the symptoms are so slight that people just think they have a cold or a mild case of the flu. All the while they remain just like a 2020 version of Typhoid Mary. Until this country gets a handle on testing so we know with some certainty that it is safe to go back to normal activities I will remain at home. In the meantime we are clueless about the real extent of the pandemic.

I haven’t become a hermit because of this but I only shop once a week now. It’s rare to find my local Kroger type store completely out of anything but a few items like hand sanitizer (didn’t look last visit). It’s not fun to stop doing all of the things I would normally do with groups of people. I have a feeling there might be a lot more candidates for the Darwin award in 2020 than in previous years.

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Vegas LED Fan wrote:
I keep reading from many posters that this is no worse than the flu based upon the fact that so many Americans die of the flu each year. There are a couple of differences. We don’t really know a lot about the CV-19 because it has only been around for a short period of time. It seems to be transmitted more easily than the flu which means eventually we will have a lot of cases. We have a yearly immunization for flu and at least some treatments (Tamiflu) to lessen the severity. We have NO immunization and no proven ways to mitigate the effects in serious cases. In some cases the symptoms are so slight that people just think they have a cold or a mild case of the flu. All the while they remain just like a 2020 version of Typhoid Mary. Until this country gets a handle on testing so we know with some certainty that it is safe to go back to normal activities I will remain at home. In the meantime we are clueless about the real extent of the pandemic.

I haven’t become a hermit because of this but I only shop once a week now. It’s rare to find my local Kroger type store completely out of anything but a few items like hand sanitizer (didn’t look last visit). It’s not fun to stop doing all of the things I would normally do with groups of people. I have a feeling there might be a lot more candidates for the Darwin award in 2020 than in previous years.

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Hitting us pretty hard on Long Island, Suffolk county. Checking the maps on weather.com, Suffolk is turning into one of the hardest hit counties in the country. My daughter's boyfriend was exposed - worked with a guy who got sick, tested positive. hearing of more cases - friend's relatives, etc. Still some bad cases of people getting refused testing from doctors, takes weeks in some cases we've been hearing. Signs from direct experience of friends, the homeless population appears to be getting hit hard and they are reluctant to get help, so many unreported cases here.

I myself had a bad case of bronchitis which got scary one morning with breathing, but got the antibiotics and steroid pack (diagnosed from a FaceTime appt), so doing much better now. But at the time when I had breathing troubles, was real scary, think'n I had it. I don't get sick often so just a strange coincidence I guess.

Basically it seems like we can't see docs anymore, unless you want to stand on the outdoor lines for an ER...

As of last night, 2700 reported cases, 20 deaths in the county, out of about 1.5 million population.

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15.5% of those tested in USA, are positive
iow, 1 out of 7 people tested are infected.

So far, only 0.2% of the USA population has been tested
iow only 1 out of every 50,000 people in USA has been tested.

IF the ratio of positive to tested was applied to the entire USA population, that would be over 50 MILLION people in USA infected.

That would be more people than the entire population of New York and Texas combined.

according to this site
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html
USA now has the most confirmed cases of any country, (5% more cases than China).

The curve in each country:

fwiw, the Total population of China is more than 4 times larger than the USA

brad
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Vegas LED Fan wrote:
I have a feeling there might be a lot more candidates for the Darwin award in 2020 than in previous years.

It kills mostly people of the ages where they have already reproduced or are unlikely to and largely doesn’t kill the young before they reproduce, or have their main chances to, so Darwin Awards don’t really figure in to this.

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Here is an article published yesterday March 26, by Anthony S. Fauci, M.D., H. Clifford Lane, M.D., and Robert R. Redfield, M.D.

Covid-19 — Navigating the Uncharted
New England Journal of Medicine

Excerpt: “” If one assumes that the number of asymptomatic or minimally symptomatic cases is several times as high as the number of reported cases, the case fatality rate may be considerably less than 1%. This suggests that the overall clinical consequences of Covid-19 may ultimately be more akin to those of a severe seasonal influenza (which has a case fatality rate of approximately 0.1%) or a pandemic influenza (similar to those in 1957 and 1968) rather than a disease similar to SARS or MERS, which have had case fatality rates of 9 to 10% and 36%, respectively.”“

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The part that you cite is well known for a while now. No it is not SARS or MERS.
A small detail is: do you let a disease that is 10 times as deadly as flu (mind that flu is a huge killer every year, it is not the common cold) become even more deadly, 30 times the flu, by allowing everybody to get it at the same time so that hospital treatment becomes impossible?

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My wife is a nurse practitioner working at a NY city hospital . Back in July she had an elevator accident where it fell from the 8th floor to
the basement . She is still at home recovering
As bad as that has been I am sort of relieved she is not back at work yet.

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It seems Covid-19 can cause severe long-term damage to one's lungs. Here's an interesting arcticle the shows the virus impact on the lungs via virtual reality technology.

https://www.gwhospital.com/resources/podcasts/covid19-vr-technology

 

" [...] Dr. Mortman is especially concerned with the possibility of enduring damage to the lungs of those who survive COVID-19. “When that inflammation does not subside with time, then it becomes essentially scarring in the lungs, creating long-term damage,” he said. “It could impact somebody’s ability to breathe in the long term. [...]"

“Everyone, deep in their hearts, is waiting for the end of the world to come.” (Haruki Murakami, 1Q84)

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I haven’t heard of flu victims overtaxing the healthcare systems across the world as this has. The flu should not even be in the same conversation as this. These deaths and potential deaths are in addition to, not in place of flu deaths. It serves no purpose to downplay this except to encourage reckless behaviour. If it turns out to be overhyped then consider ourselves lucky.

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Henk4U2 wrote:
IF it happens, nobody will tell, because any form of euthanasia is a big NON in France.

Whew. Thought at first you said big NUN. That brings back some nightmares… Shocked

Anyway, there are ways of “getting around” that. Eg, a patient who’s circling the drain and is only looking forward to a few more days (or hours) of pain, can be dosed with enough morphine to kill, but it’s officially done only with the intent to ease pain’n‘suffering.

Ie, no jury would look too closely at the motive. Someone with a good chance of recovery, sure, but someone who’s already terminal, zero chance of recovery, nope.

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G0OSE wrote:
I could see within a day or so, NO ONE was going to follow the guidelines – for our arcade we had 1, yes 1 bottle of spray cleaner supplied and were expected to clean all machine buttons and touch points hourly……right. In a huge arcade…. that 1 bottle lasted less than 1 day and we were back to regular ‘non covid’ cleaner, and it couldn’t have been done hourly simply because there is 1 member of staff working on the floor in the day, and obviously they do other things like look after guests and machines! …

Yeah, that’s one of those situations where an “anonymous tip” to the right agency would be warranted. Followed by the not-so-implicit threat that if nothing’s done by the next day, your next call is to the press to swarm the place, “out” it, and point out official inaction/incompetence.

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jon_slider wrote:
15.5% of those tested in USA, are positive
iow, 1 out of 7 people tested are infected.

So far, only 0.2% of the USA population has been tested
iow only 1 out of every 50,000 people in USA has been tested.

IF the ratio of positive to tested was applied to the entire USA population, that would be over 50 MILLION people in USA infected.

True dat, but I’d guess the majority of those tested are those who are already feeling sick/coldy/fluey, not those who are asymptomatic and get tested just for fun.

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Lightbringer
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brad wrote:
Vegas LED Fan wrote:
I have a feeling there might be a lot more candidates for the Darwin award in 2020 than in previous years.

It kills mostly people of the ages where they have already reproduced or are unlikely to and largely doesn’t kill the young before they reproduce, or have their main chances to, so Darwin Awards don’t really figure in to this.

Killjoy…

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vresto wrote:
But i have a question for everybody in this thread-what do you think?When this pandemic will be finally over,how will be our world change? Or,will change anything?Or just measuring temperature on the airports? Or is there anything deeper we have to change in our lives??Philosophical thoughts for my another single evening….
Here in the USA, when there has been a flu outbreak, people wouldn’t change their lives at all. Meaning, for most people, they wouldn’t exercise any public hygiene restrictions. No mask wearing. No sanitary wipes. No gloves. No distancing. After the highly virulent #COVID19 pandemic, I expect that for the next flu, there will be more caution. Knowing us Americans and our relatively “short memories,” that caution will subside. BUT… I expect in Europe, the change will be sustained much longer.
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Bwana wrote:
My wife is a nurse practitioner working at a NY city hospital . Back in July she had an elevator accident where it fell from the 8th floor to the basement . She is still at home recovering As bad as that has been I am sort of relieved she is not back at work yet.

Yikes, that is a pretty scary accident. I’m glad to hear she is recovering.

pennzy wrote:
I haven’t heard of flu victims overtaxing the healthcare systems across the world as this has. The flu should not even be in the same conversation as this. These deaths and potential deaths are in addition to, not in place of flu deaths. It serves no purpose to downplay this except to encourage reckless behaviour. If it turns out to be overhyped then consider ourselves lucky.

Yeah, watching NY hospitals going through the same thing that happened in northern Italy I can’t imagine the thought process of someone still stuck on “but but the flu!”.

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