GFS16 - Battery Indicator Tailcap Light & 1mR FET Tailswitch! (Rev B)

194 posts / 0 new
Last post
BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

I’m using a supercap for the design rather than a battery, and I’m not going to use a holder for it for the schiobovine design since it’s actually pretty easy to connect it directly to GND:
https://www.skilhunt.com/product/h03-rc-magnetic-rechargeable-led-headlamp/

It’s also safer Smile
And I can use a lower value resistor to charge it since it can be charged faster.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

I built one GFS16 fet switch with the rechargeable battery and 2 with the Super Cap that BlueSwordM linked from digikey.
The Super Cap is much easier to work with. It comes drained at .001 volt. It doesn’t care if you short it with tweezers. It with stands soldering very well. You can bend the tin tabs without having to worry about shorting and destroying it. I recommend trying the Super Cap for anyone who might be having trouble with the battery. The Super Cap is almost the exact same size as the battery.

.
This is the SC (super cap) soldered in the same position as the battery. The only difference is the SC is backwards with the casing soldered to the smaller outside pad.

In this pic you can see the SC sticks up above the switch and will hit the original S2+ washer or lighted GFS18. That’s the reason Loneoceans added the oblong hole in the GFS18 led PCB. If using the washer it will need to be modified with a hole for the battery or SC to stick up through, then some way to hold the washer in place so that it doesn’t spin hitting the top of the battery and ripping it off the PCB when installing the switch holder ring. Maybe glue or epoxy.

.

.

I came up with a different solution that could work without hitting the original washer or having to have a hole in anything. I only tried this with the SC because it seems a little smaller and is a whole lot easier to work with.

.

.

The tin pads can be bent if very gentle, so that the battery can lay back towards the switch. Its a little tricky to get the right bend, and a little tough to solder on the outside pad. It can be done though. I bent the the center tab of the SC on about a 45 degree angle and the arrow looking tab on the case I just cut off as it’s not needed. Laid the omten switch in position and checked clearance. Done that a few times bending the tab back further until I had good fitment. Once the SC was lower than the switch shelf I placed the SC in the right position for contact to the pads with no shorting once soldered. I then applied a small drop of UV glue in one corner of the SC tin tab on the big PCB battery pad and turned on my UV light and presto its held in place. Soldered the big pad first with a small soldering tip and then very carefully soldered the case to the small outside pad, with just enough solder to make a good connection. Doesn’t need much as this is very low current.

.

.

Now it will clear the washer or GFS18 with out shorting or having to have a hole for clearance.

.

I used the Q2 LFPAK33 and added the larger Blue spring. If you use the Q1 PowerPAK SO8 then this will make the switch assemble taller but adds more clearance of the SC or battery because the switch shelf is higher. This option would be the easier to build without having to lean the SC or maybe just slightly to clear the washer or GFS18.

I changed R1 to 500 ohms and the SC takes about 1 to 2 minutes to charge up before I could operate the GXB172 in turbo. This is after the battery is installed in the light and screwed together in the off position. The lower modes would work but turbo flashed 3 times indicating low battery voltage, after a minute or so of being off, turbo began to work when the SC became charged. If the light was drawing a few amps I suspect it would work within a minute if the switch is in the off position. On the second SC GFS16 I built I used a 220 ohm for R1 and after screwed together and being off, turbo will work between 30 to 60 seconds. Might could go even lower but this 200 ohm range seemed very usable to me.

BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

Yep, that looks like really nice.

BTW guys, I’m just waiting for the Omten switches to come to start building these FET switches.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

Using the bigger Q1 might save you some work Blue. Makes the switch shelf higher to clear the SC. Wink
I built this second one with the leaning SC this morning. I been playing with it off and on all day, it’s worked very reliable.
Very cool fet switch now with a super cap.

I built a GFS16 with a battery and the led GFS18 last night. It works but doesn’t act right, probably something I done in the process of the build. The GFS18 seems to be working correctly, something in the GFS16 isn’t hardly right I guess. I tested the led GFS18 on my power supply and the led color change to voltages were dead on, cut off voltage was dead on too.

clientequator
clientequator's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 45 min ago
Joined: 12/05/2018 - 15:42
Posts: 286

Moderator007, this is very cool! Did you see any difference between using SC and battery (after they both charge?) I am wondering what the run time is for SC compare to lithium battery before each charging.

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

No difference in performance. Just takes a minute to charge. If you unscrew the tail switch and leave it off several minutes it does drain back down and needs to be screwed back on and set in the off position for about one minute, then it works threw all the modes. Once it’s charged a few minutes and turned on, I have clicked and changed modes over a 100 times quickly in a row, it just keeps switching modes like normal. Thumbs Up

BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

We have to compare the quantity of energy between them first.

The lithium ion cell has 10,8J of energy.

The super capacity has 0,4356J of energy.

It can store 25x more energy, meaning it can last 25x longer.

One advantage of using the super cap though is it can be charged extremely quickly.

A full charge can be achieved in 9 min with a 100Ohm resistor.

A partial charge will take around 30 sec-1min.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

Thanks for the info Blue, gives me something to go by now. Thumbs Up
All I know is, It works great and thanks for sharing your idea.

contactcr
Offline
Last seen: 1 day 16 hours ago
Joined: 05/19/2017 - 18:52
Posts: 3709
Location: US

Dont these super caps self discharge must faster than a lion battery? Just comparing the capacity is not enough. Caps are probably way more reliable in the long run though.

These switches may not be a great idea for people who physically lock out their lights frequently.

BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

Yeah.

At 40%/month at 70C, and 15-20%/month at ambient temps and pressure(20-25C), it’s going to be fully discharged down to 2,0V after 4-5 months.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 days ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 15065
Location: LI NY

Look'n good all! Totally sort of unrelated, I have to get some ice blue AUX LED's. Got every color but that. Anyone have ideas? I think my previous LED buys were off of eBay.

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

I built and added the led board to the GSF16 with the SC. It works great.
One very cool feature with the SC and the led board is that when you first twist the tail back on the leds don’t light up, then at about 30 seconds the red leds light up, then at another 30 seconds the blue leds light up and the switch will work. When first screwed together the leds are indicating the SC charge. Big Smile

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

Tom E wrote:

Look’n good all! Totally sort of unrelated, I have to get some ice blue AUX LED’s. Got every color but that. Anyone have ideas? I think my previous LED buys were off of eBay.


I don’t think they have ice blue leds but I just use blue and a high value resistor (120k to 200k). Looks more ice blue when not driven hard.
https://www.fasttech.com/search?0805%20leds
Takes a blue moon to get here but order different sizes and several colors and you’ll be stocked up when they arrive. Thumbs Up

.

.

I changed the resistor values on the led board today. I changed R3 to 536k and the low voltage threshold activated at 3.14v.
I changed R5 to 390K for a cut off at 2.83v, I’m ordering a few more values to play around with. Ideally I’m thinking 3.2v on the low and 2.75v on the cut off.
Most all li-ions now a days can run down to 2.7v under load with no problems, so I’m reducing the values to more resemble the cells recommended cut off voltage.
A cell under a heavy load with a cut off of 3v would still have some usable capacity left. In HKJ’s test data it’s usually given down to 2.8v.

This extra wouldn’t make much difference if a light was running in just turbo mode but if the low threshold voltage was reached, the leds turn to red then changing to a lower mode might give you enough usable light to get you out of a pickle before the cut off voltage was reached and your left in the dark. At least using this in combination with the GXB172 I would think is better, since the driver draws quite a bit of current in high or turbo.

I also changed the charging resistor on the fet switch board to 130 ohms (R1) and didn’t seem to make much difference in charging time. I’m wondering if my bleedback resistor isn’t a little to high. I’ll keep playing around with value’s until I find the happy medium.

.

Update: Almost forgot, I switched all the led current limiting resistors out to 165k. This seems about right on the blue led with a clear switch boot if your one of those people like me that stands the light up on the bed side table at bed time encase of a emergency. I don’t like it lighting up the whole room blue while I’m trying to sleep, the misses doesn’t either Facepalm . I prefer a little dimmer than what the 165k is producing. Since the red leds is a “your about to be in the dark warning” I’m thinking around 50k bright in day or night and the low voltage blue leds around 180 to 200K, blue just barely noticeable in the daylight but easily seen in the dark.

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 days ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 15065
Location: LI NY

I got plenty of blues, pinks, reds, oranges, greens. I really thought ice blue was a separate LED - Lexel must know?

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

I have seen them around in ice blue but I don’t own one to know what color that is exactly. I just assumed it was like a white blue, dim or light blue.
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Kingbright/APT2012PR54F-A-SC?qs=sGA...
You already know what the trit color ice blue is, I kind of figured it was like that. http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1034899#comment-1034899

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 days ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 15065
Location: LI NY

Yea, I know the trits are unique in ice blue, figured the SMD LED's would be too, but I really dunno -haven't done serious searching yet.

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

I was looking around at a few places for ice blue and decided to switch my search strategy, came up with this.
https://www.google.com/search?q=0805+ice+blue+led&tbm=isch&source=hp&sa=...
I might order a few off ebay, look cool. Baby blue. Big Smile

clientequator
clientequator's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 45 min ago
Joined: 12/05/2018 - 15:42
Posts: 286

I order a lot of different led including this aqua blue one from aliexpress. They have 0805and 0603 size:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100PCS-0805-Ice-Blue-2012-Light-Blue-Cle...SMD-LED-Indication-2-0-1/32715527561.html

Tom E
Tom E's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 3 days ago
Joined: 08/19/2012 - 08:23
Posts: 15065
Location: LI NY

Ordered those ice blues - for $2.44 shipped, worth it for that price. This is the store, US:

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/1758868?spm=a2g1y.12024536.pcShopHead_11169370.0

 

okwchin
okwchin's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 4 months ago
Joined: 01/07/2011 - 04:41
Posts: 1164
Location: Australia

Only just came across this switch, its amazing work!!

Will it take much for a board like this to be implemented as an electronic switch with a small momentary switch instead of a clicky? Im imagining that it needs a bit more electronics to store the switch state.

Mechanically it also wont be the same either.. but this thought comes about for a replacement switch for a V10R or other DIY projects.

"like everyone else - I’m looking for my next “last” flashlight" -  ohnonothimagain

mfrey
Offline
Last seen: 2 years 3 months ago
Joined: 08/25/2013 - 10:23
Posts: 10
Location: West Virginia, USA
Fady wrote:

Hello all, 1st I want to thank loneoceans for sharing this with us. just finished building 2 switches and they work with the H17F driver only if a bleeder resistor is added, I used 2.2Kohms and all functions flawlessly. My question to loneoceans or anyone who may know… would a lower value bleeder expedite the coin battery charging time.. with the 2.2Kohms it took about 3HRs off time to charge from 2.55v to 2.67v on a full 18650 battery, Thanks.


![img]https://i.imgur.com/64TojtG.jpg[/img]!


![img]https://i.imgur.com/bSa23Fr.jpg[/img]!


![img]https://i.imgur.com/eugZNBC.jpg[/img]!


![img]https://i.imgur.com/Q1uZNvW.jpg[/img]!


![img]https://i.imgur.com/N5EzwVN.jpg?1[/img]!


 


2.2Kohms bleeder is only good for the switch board alone, for both the switch and the led board… 3× 2.2Kohms or 733ohms worked perfectly.

Forgive my ignorance but where do the bleeder resistors go on the boards? I’m similarly interested in building this switch for use with an Mtnelectronics H17F. Are they soldered in addition to the cited components or in place of some them?

moderator007
moderator007's picture
Offline
Last seen: 41 min 30 sec ago
Joined: 12/23/2012 - 04:47
Posts: 3792
Location: North Carolina

The bleed resistor goes anywhere you can get battery positive to battery ground (outside driver ring) on the driver. Its a additional component that needs to be added in some drivers. Some work without a bleed resistor.
Here’s a few pics.
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/37851

JS93
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 5 min ago
Joined: 03/09/2020 - 11:57
Posts: 17
Location: Australia

Hi all,

I’m having a bit of trouble ordering the boards from OSH Park. Im using the tailcap switch and LED board in an S2+ Triple but I cant see how I change the board thickness from 0.8mm to 1.6mm?
Is this necesary when using this system in an S2+ host?

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 3314
Location: Central IL

During the checkout process you select the “service” you want: 1.6mm standard 1oz, 0.8mm 2oz, after dark, medium run, or rush order. Just pick the standard 1.6mm 1oz service.

JS93
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 5 min ago
Joined: 03/09/2020 - 11:57
Posts: 17
Location: Australia

Awesome, thanks gchart. Cant wait to make a start on this!

JS93
Offline
Last seen: 6 months 5 min ago
Joined: 03/09/2020 - 11:57
Posts: 17
Location: Australia

Would anyone be able to suggest an alternative Super Barrier rectifier to the one suggested (SBRT05U20S3)?
I am having trouble tracking on down on digikey.

Thanks

gchart
gchart's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 03/19/2016 - 11:57
Posts: 3314
Location: Central IL

JS93 wrote:
Would anyone be able to suggest an alternative Super Barrier rectifier to the one suggested (SBRT05U20S3)?
I am having trouble tracking on down on digikey.

Thanks


I don’t think the particular diode is critical as long as it’s the SOD-323 footprint. The BAT54 is pretty common and cheap.
BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

Anyway, that reminds me.

I still have a lot of these, and since I’m getting some new soldering equipment pretty soon, I could make some very low resistance switches Smile

I do have the issue of the components being a bit problematic to source however.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

@gchart, do you know where to get supercaps? I can find all other components still available obviously, but not the supercap.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

BlueSwordM
BlueSwordM's picture
Offline
Last seen: 23 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 11/29/2017 - 12:34
Posts: 6504
Location: Canada

I found it!

https://www.digikey.ca/en/products/detail/seiko-instruments/XH414HG-IV01...

That means I can still build it Smile

It’s also cheaper than when I looked last time, which is surprising.

My very own high current Beryllium Copper springs Gen 3:
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/67401
Liitokala Aliexpress Stores Battery Fraud: http://budgetlightforum.com/node/60547

Pages