Tbh, I don’t think this is a big problem after all, as long as a (working) backup is available. Off-the-shelf components - especially those which are extensively tested due to millions of units sold to customers like this Xbox game controller - do not necessarily have to be a problem for safety or reliability; it depends on the overall concept and the safety thinking of the designer and operator.
There is a picture around with some passengers inside of this submersible. More concerning (at least for me) is the material of the hull. I cannot find any reliable information of what material is really used in which thickness, but if the use of carbon fiber is true, I could imagine that a catastrophic failure and a complete implosion could occur without any warning, like suddenly cracking components of carbon fiber in other machinery.
But in newest articles there is a report of ‘hammering noises’ being heard near the Titanic site, like here (there are several other sources also here in Germany). Hopefully it is somehow possible to rescue them - if they are still alive in this submersible craft…
I thought that you sail on a ship to that place and then get into a small module with which you can get to the Titanic. But I couldn’t be in a submarine for that long time.
Isn’t it ironic the people in the sub were all considered to be smart people. I would think someone a lot smarter than me would look at the risks and not only pass but keep their $250k.
If you can spend that much money on a small trip (one day down-and-up, a bit more if you count the transfers) than you start looking for the things other privileged people have missed. I mean: maybe a round trip into space isn’t that exceptional any more. It has nothing to do with smart as in common sense, but with smart in out-smarting other rich people in search of outrageous activities.
I agree, and I’d roll that out to people doing anything extreme. I don’t know about other places in the world, but many rescue services are funded almost entirely by charity in the UK and the goodwill of volunteers. Free or not, these services have to be paid for by someone, and I doubt anyone donating meant their money to go towards rescuing billionaires on ‘jollies’ - more so it is meant to fund the services to rescue average joes who get into trouble doing ‘normal’ activities, or have a medical emergency.
I think any of these extreme things should be made to take out insurance to fund their rescues.
In hindsight, knowing now that things went terribly wrong on this trip, it’s easy to question how smart people could trust a craft with so many alleged issues in such a risky environment. But almost everyone tries subconsciously to believe what we want to believe, and also to avoid information or doubts that might lead to changing our beliefs or changing our mind about embarking on a new experience we really want.
Smart people are just as susceptible to delusions and willful ignorance as are people of average intelligence. It takes a lot of work and self control (and resistance to social influences) to avoid the hazards of that reality. And even if you succeed in avoiding them most of the time, that doesn’t ensure success all the time.
It’s not looking very hopeful since they have not even been located yet and with less than 24 hours of air left, it would take longer than that to attempt any sort of rescue. Which, the only option would be to try to attach a cable to it with another submersible which isn’t very likely to be successful.
An Xbox game controller would have been preferable. They are actually using a budget Logitech controller. That’s a poverty controller right there, anyone who plays video games can tell you all the ways that the first-party controllers are better.
Also it’s true the US military uses Xbox controllers for some things. But none of those applications include piloting manned vehicles.
I’m sorta a Sony fanboy, so even though Xbox controllers are good, I prefer Sony controllers for playing games.
(The Sony digital pad (or d-pad) is really nice compared to the Xbox d-pad.)
But, yeah, I would choose an Xbox controller over a budget Logitech controller.
Indeed, however there’s also some incentive not to pass that information along lest the capabilities of the array be made known.
Doubt they were insurable (the submersible and its operations anyway) prior due to the firm’s refusal to adhere to established standards around commercial submarines. The company itself will get carved up in the courts although its liabilities vastly exceed its resources.
Terminal reality failure and suddenly you’re fish paste.
The cylindrical portion of the pressure hull is principally carbon fiber with integrated titanium flanges to interface with titanium cylindrical caps at the ends. I gather carbon fiber is profoundly unsuited to being a negative pressure vessel, something the former safety director brought up in their wrongful termination lawsuit.
While this has been harped on, it’s emblematic of larger problems: a wireless controller was one of their primary control interfaces. Wireless adds 3 additional unnecessary points of failure: battery, transmitter, receiver. Just using a wired controller would remove complexity and its associated liabilities. And I’ve got my doubt that any COTS controllers fare well in - to say nothing of being rated for - salt water exposure: it’s in the air and causes subtle corrosion everywhere.
The emergency ballast release system depended on the ‘crew’ literally rolling the submersible from within by moving to one side of the sub in order to induce a roll so it would fall off hooks (ideally that imbalance would then cause a counter-roll so the other ballast would fall off the opposite side). Better hope no one bumps into that awkward touchpad during said maneuver.
At least (partly) disagree. The most vulnerable aspect on a sub is the connection between “inside” and “outside”. It is practically impossible to make a fixed electrical connection to the outside of a sub. Electric cables are relatively soft. With pressures of up to 400 bar, the water just follows the cables to the inside.
Yeah, I was going to mention that (but I didn’t.)
For playing games, wireless controllers are convenient.
But if my life depended on my controller, I’d use the best wired controller I could find.
I’m confident that submarines require wiring penetrations of the hull for both comms and power to which there are turnkey solutions from multiple suppliers. Definitely don’t want to be depending on the likes of a bluetooth signal being transmitted through the hull to critical control systems located on the exterior - and judging by the interior photos we’ve seen there’s no reason to expect that such systems were outboard.
In this application I’d rather controls that would look right at home on a WWII-era warship capable of surviving shrapnel damage from a shell hit within the compartment. Clunky and expensive but also highly reliable and capable of being hardwired to the systems and components they control rather than asking permission of software.
I don’t disagree that there is a large issue with policy here.
But here’s why I think the choice of controller is significant.
third party controllers like this tend to have weird deadzones and odd sensitivity curves
they tend to stop working correctly sooner than 1st party offerings. this could mean total failure, or stick drift
All 1st party controllers are wireless, but can also be plugged in via USB to bypass the issues with wireless connectivity.
When plugged in via USB the controller’s batteries would not matter
First party controllers use bluetooth and don’t require a small cheaply made usb dongle to work with a device
It is possible that choosing this controller could have resulted in an easily avoidable collision that would damage the hull, propulsion systems, or weight release systems.
A controller with hall-sensor sticks would be the ideal choice and a step above even Microsoft or Sony’s offerings for reliability. The Logitech though? That’s like driving your car with Fisher-Price parts in the steering column.
I have an Xbox controller purely for backup to use with my computer in case I experience a weird incompatibility issue.
In practice I mostly use the Sony controllers even when playing games on PC. Sony controllers are plug-and-play with Windows so you don’t even have to install any kind of extra software anymore.
Since getting a PS5 i use the DualSense for everything. I don’t care about the touted haptic feedback (I turn that crap off) but the ergonomics are the best so far I think.
I also read that their only communication system used text messages. They didn’t have voice communication. And no backup location Pinger in case the main comms failed.
