You should have some kind of multimeter, you can get one for like 6 bucks. I’m stuck in the middle of this conversation, I want people to be safe but I agree that there can be a perceived elitism when it comes to new technology.
I’ll just say this, anyone that adopts a fairly new technology should educate themselves about it and be willing to invest in the relevant equipment to be safe in using it. That shouldn’t scare off anyone that can be responsible.
But why? If I’m out 3km from home walking my dog ( actually her 80lbs walks me ) and I think my cell is a bit low, am I going to pull out a DMM ?
Also, once home, the charger tells me the cells’ status’
Have you used one? They are awesome, and will provide you with way more data than an average charger can. I never said you should carry it with you 
I use several different meters for different purposes a few times a week so perhaps I’m just used to having them handy.
Still, I’d trust a meter over a charger every time. Does your charger give you voltage readings?
This is an enthusiast forum and so I’d hope casual users can understand when members become a bit more serious about the different attributes of things than perhaps is absolutely necessary. For example to a casual flashlight user, the difference of a few hundred lumens is barely worth note while here it’s the difference between indifference and hundreds of lights sold. The same can apply with Li-Ion cells and their safety concerns. Many people may take the warnings with a grain of salt until they have one vent, or may heed the warnings enough to avoid catastrophe but may still not worry much about it. I don’t see the enthusiast crowd being enthusiastic about their hobby as a bad thing though and this is the place for it.
I agree 200% with that. But if we scare off / shoot down the “uneducated” this forum is nothing more than a self indulgent elitist club.
We all started as newbies. All of us.
Hmmm… cup half full/cup half empty.
The OP looks at our discussions with newbies as scaring them away from li-ion use.
I look at our discussions with newbies as not emphasizing safety issues enough.
Example: BLF decision
All sorts of helpful suggestions were given to this neophyte about which flashlight to buy, but not a word about li-ion hazards, safety precautions, or proper maintenance.
(Well, nothing was mentioned until I put a word or two in. O:-) )
that, and everything else here seems to be way more helpful here rather than over on cpf!.
Some - not all.
And yes, there have been occasions on here where a person has been advised against getting them,and the poster ends up saying they are literally hesitant to get liion cells - solely due to a member / members say so.
Used to years ago when I was into R/C racing and tuning.
And no, doesn’t show me voltages.
Two sides of the same coin.
You look at those frustrated souls as a tragedy.
I look at those blissfully encouraged without any cautionary advice as a potential tragedy.
And I think we’re in agreement that such matters could be handled better. 
+1
As newbie I feel very thankful for words of warning on this super friendly forum.
I buy only flashlights where I can put a 3xAAA holder in as gifts.
Li ion cells are usually protected by the construction in mobile devices but could miss all that when bought as cells for flashlights so it is important to issue solid information and warnings just like BLF tends to do and should do IMHO.
Would you air up your tires before a long trip without using a pressure gauge? “Yeah, that looks about full enough, let’s hit the road, guys!”
Or is that being too harsh and/or elitist too?
Perhaps a few posts “scare off” newbies regarding LiIon cells, but overall this is the friendliest moist helpful forum I’ve even been a member of. And there ARE types of people who shouldn’t use LiIon cells, just as there are types of people who shouldn’t drive cars or own deadly weapons or even keep pets. But I think all are treated fairly here- I’ve not seen anyone being judged like thgat by others. And our care in making sure newbies understand LiIon’s has had to have saved lots of folks from frustration as well as saved them from some likely danger.
If we recommend a LiIon-only light or LiIon usage to a newbie, we have a moral obligation to ensure that they understand how to be safe with them. They CAN be hazardous if not dealt with properly. If all LiIon cells, chargers, and lights were all engineered for safety like phones and laptops are we wouldn’t need to be so diligent about the risks involved, but since they aren’t like that we can’t ignore the matter. And in this I think people here have mostly achieved the right balance in how we explain the situation.
I am forever grateful to have received my LiIon education here and I still remember the words which first sank into my thick skull regarding their quirks: “Remember- cheap lights but only good cells and chargers”. Succinct, non-abusive, helpful, and memorable in a small package of words, those 8 words have allowed me to have the best experience possible with LiIon cells and you can hardly do better than that.
Phil
I’ve seen no hostility.
That is completely different, a LiIon in a mobile phone is in a hard case with multiple protections built in. An exposed unprotected 18650 is a quite different beast. A protected 18650 is better, but potentially very dangerous.
well said +1 on this one too!
While I’ve been into flashlights for years I am completely new to the subtle intricacies of flashlight technology and complementary power sources. This forum has been, without a doubt, the friendliest and most helpful that I have ever been on since I began frequenting forums back in 1999. I have found the emphasis on safety and vigilance when using liion to be essential in getting it stuck into my head that these things can hurt people if used incorrectly, or if a faulty unit has been purchased. If users had been wishywashy with knowledge seekers then they may not take away, or at least respect, the information the forum provides to them. None of this is rocket science but you do need to be careful.
Anyone that is “scared off” from l-ion cells because they are told about proper safety precautions, probably should be scared off. Lithium-ion are pretty safe, but not when poorly treated. The “kind of person” that is used to NiMH or NiCad tools and regularly drains batteries until they’re dead, then charges them up for 24 hours or more, probably shouldn’t use lithium-ion until they’re properly educated and willing to do a bit of effort to maintain the cells.
I would feel perfectly safe with lithion-ion batteries (I have some, but not many), because I’m a battery-nerd. However, I still stick mainly to Eneloops, because I can be lazy if I want, and I don’t need to worry about things like capacity-loss from long-term storage at full charge.
I generally don’t recommend lithium-ion to novices, because good quality NiMH can achieve most of what lithium-ion can do, albeit in a more bulky package. To me, it’s a reasonable trade-off.
You seem to post a lot of antagonistic replies on this forum.
Li-ion is dangerous. Plain and simple. If you can’t respect them, then they probably aren’t for you. Just like anything else that is dangerous. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone really post anything to contrary. And likewise, recommendations to not use them are usually based on this. The fact you want to ignore this says a lot more about you, than it does about the wider forum community.
Exactly.
Yes, I build lights using Li-ion cells, because, for high power and voltage requirements, NiMH don’t do the trick. Yes, used properly, Li-ion are very safe, but……. used improperly, such as running them too down to nothing and trying to charge them back up, can cause problems. I am lazy when it comes to cell maintenance. I don’t want to have to check voltage, or any of that. NiMH cells I run till they are almost drained and throw them in the charger and walk away. When I come back, they are ready to go, over and over again. Can’t do that with Li-ion. I also don’t carry any high powered lights. I don’t need them and have no use for them. Modding is what I like, the process of modification, not using the end result. It’s why I always sell my creations. I love modding, but I don’t have much use at all for flashlights in general.