Rey's Titanium X6, re-make

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DB Custom
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Rey's Titanium X6, re-make

I was quite pleased to find HKJ’s review on the little Aspire 18350 cells recently. More capacity and better discharge rates in these half cells mean a lot to me. So, looking at the first thing I wanted to improve with them I kept coming back to my Titanium X6 from Rey. I have it loaded with trits so I can’t flame anodize it, but perhaps I can go about it another way…

I ordered 3 of the relatively new XHP-50.2 from Richard, already had a XM-L footprint triple 32mm MCPCB from Cutter, and already had a Khatod optic to fit it. (The Khatod has openings large enough to fit the XHP-50.2 without a dome slice. Smile ) Looking at how the stack would align I needed a few extra millimeters under the MCPCB. So, instead of just putting copper under the board I made an entirely new pill from Tellurium Copper. That 3mm taller to aid in the spacing and thermal properties. Built up a 17mm FET with 8.4V LVP, and today the emitters got here. Not one to wait around, I built my first X6 Triple XHP-50.2! Smile The emitters fit beautifully into this Khatod optic and everything seems to work fine. Charging up an old pair of light purple Efest 18350’s to get a general idea what this bad boy should be capable of, waiting on my Aspire 18350’s to arrive… they’re en-route.

Here’s the new pill, next to a spare one…

How does 7693.5 lumens sound on the old pair of cells? Big Smile Holy smokes! By quite a margin the most powerful X6 I’ve built so far! lol
Edit: On the newer dark purple metallic looking Efest 18350 I got 10,315.5 lumens at 15.87 Amps! Big Smile

A top view of the 3 50.2’s inside the Khatod optic…

A quick tail amp check showed 10.41A from the old pair of Efest 18350’s, the new Aspire’s should do better and with nearly twice the capacity as well. I won’t be at all surprised if the new cells push this up over 8000 lumens.

More when I can…

Edit: A few pics from when the light was originally built, August 13, 2015…








I’m a Ti Freak, and the X6 is one of my all time favorite lights, so this was a birthday present to me, from me. Big Smile

Edit: I had forgotten to engage moon mode by grounding pin 5 on the driver, and I felt like 10,000 lumens was too much in this light so I wanted to reduce the wires to 22ga from 20ga. I opened it up and was going to pull the pill so I could put thermal paste in for a better contact but it had swollen with heat and simply wouldn’t unscrew. Ok, forget that part. I replaced the wires with 22ga, then when I put it back together I crimped the edges of the copper onto the driver to hold it in snug and prevent it from rotating when screwing in the battery tube. Added some solder to bridge driver/copper and ensure my ground was solid. Reassembled it and now I get these readings…

0.05A for 29.12 Lumens
0.19A for 155.6
0.44A for 455.4
1.33A for 1283.4
5.46A for 3774.3
11.35A for 6865.5
17.22A for 10660.5

Well, I tried! lol

EDIT: Not being one to leave well enough alone, I tried my new pair of Efest 20700 cells on this Ti X6 50.2… had to remove the battery tube of course. So, with this kind of result I may have to make a new 2 cell titanium battery tube! Silly

13,558.5 lumens, out the front. Sick, I know…

EDIT II: Sorry, the cells were at 78% on that 13,558.5 read… after a fresh charge on the 20700 Efests they give 27.84A for 14,283 lumens!! Just stinkin insane! Big Smile

Edited by: DB Custom on 06/16/2017 - 10:19
Yokiamy
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This mod screams for more images!
Very nice work Dale

EasyB
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Nice mod. This has got to be close to the record for most output in a small light! And those aspire cells will make the runtime a bit more usable. Thumbs Up

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Very nice Thumbs Up

DB Custom
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I dug out a reserve pair of the newer dark purple Efest 18350’s that I have stored with my Mokume Gane 18350 Sinner when I take it out places. Freshly charged, these 2 newer cells let this Ti X6 Triple XHP-50.2 do 10,315.5 lumens! WACK!

Far and away the most of any X6 I’ve ever made, especially considering the 18350 cell status! Remarkable!

Edit: These 2 newer cells allow 15.87A at the tail. Wink When I first built up this light I made it a quad Nichia 219C. It was capable of pulling 21A from a single LG HE-4 cell. I was a bit afraid to use it at that level, making some 4500 lumens as I recall. So now I’ve more than doubled the output while keeping the current draw at about 65% of that huge number I had before. I Like It! lol

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Just wow. How long until gets too hot?
What bin are the LEDs? J4?

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You created a monster. Well done Evil Thumbs Up

DB Custom
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Yeah Agro, J4 5700K.

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Dale…please be careful. You could steralize this side of the planet with that X6 Shocked

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DB Custom
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Gonna point it at Houston first, if that works I may well be onto something… Wink

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Hey db, i am new here.. is that light for sale?? The 8000 lumen triple xhp 50.2. Lmk thanks.

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Newlumen, no, afraid not. It’s kinda special as it was a Custom that Rey had produced. I’m a titanium nut, so with the X6 being my favorite light and this being a small run in Titanium from a member here, well, it won’t be going anywhere.

Testing it outside tonight the sheer output shone on the sides of railroad cars over 1200 yds away. And it would appear I fried a Trit vial. One of 2 green ones is now not illuminating. No visible damage, it’s just not glowing any more. It fires up green under a UV light, but is otherwise dark. These are like 2mm x 12mm in the head. There’s 10 of em. Yeah, I know. The trit vials cost as much as the Ti host did, nearly. There’s a 1.5 × 6 in the tail cap.

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They’re very delicate, crack easily and the gas escapes, even through the glue.
Too much heat Evil

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Triple XHP50.2 wowsers!
this must be a difficult situation, either blow 10K lumens or have trits glowing for a long time.

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I’m not suggesting anything, but Cutter has K2 bin in stock Wink
I guess a wider opening is not reasonably doable in this host?
Could you share some more pics of the interior?

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Just did some calculations based on djozz tests of XHP50.2. Getting the exact numbers from his chart is hard, so the results are not great, but I got 10893 LED lumen. Are the numbers that you quote LED lumens or OTF lumens?

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My numbers are out the front, from the assembled light. On this one, the numbers given were at start on fresh charged cells. Many people argue that this is misleading, but when you’re pulling 15+ Amps from a 650mAh 18350 , well, it’s a very steep slope. (24.41C…Yikes!)

Wider opening? The head takes a 35mm optic, it was made for the CUTE-3 with a 32mm Noctigon. This X6 was made as a host and the buyer had to finish the build. I want to disassemble it and use some thermal compound between the copper pill and titanium head, so I’ll get some pics (should already have some from back when it was bought but I’ve got so many pictures I’m not finding these somehow…)

Much as I’d like to go with the next bin up from Cutter I probably won’t be shopping at Cutter anymore. After spending $25 DHL shipping to get a dozen XP-L W2 2B emitters and having V6 1D arrive in their stead, and nothing done about it, that was it for me.

DB Custom
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More images posted in the OP. Wink

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DB Custom wrote:
My numbers are out the front, from the assembled light. On this one, the numbers given were at start on fresh charged cells. Many people argue that this is misleading, but when you’re pulling 15+ Amps from a 650mAh 18350 , well, it’s a very steep slope. (24.41C…Yikes!)

Wider opening? The head takes a 35mm optic, it was made for the CUTE-3 with a 32mm Noctigon. This X6 was made as a host and the buyer had to finish the build. I want to disassemble it and use some thermal compound between the copper pill and titanium head, so I’ll get some pics (should already have some from back when it was bought but I’ve got so many pictures I’m not finding these somehow…)

Much as I’d like to go with the next bin up from Cutter I probably won’t be shopping at Cutter anymore. After spending $25 DHL shipping to get a dozen XP-L W2 2B emitters and having V6 1D arrive in their stead, and nothing done about it, that was it for me.


Huh, same thing happened to me! Same XP-L W2 2B crap, V6’s instead. It’s a big cost hit to take, plus the wait….never again….done with that BS!

Really cool pics of your light Dale! Thumbs Up

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DB Custom
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Thanks Kawi,

I was thinking, with the pair of half cells, that it would probably do something like 6,000 maybe, a bit more? Boy was I surprised! It’s too much, of course, for this size light… even with the chunky copper pill. But then, there are all those other mode levels I suppose…

Yeah, it was neat that Cutter had top bins and components you can’t find elsewhere, like the Khatod optic in this build, but if he’s not going to ship what you’re buying, and not going to fix an error without it costing you even more, well, just bugger’s up the whole deal. I was willing, and told him so, to buy another dozen and just keep the V6 1D’s so they wouldn’t have to be shipped back. All he’d have to have done is pay the shipping on the correct dozen emitters. I probably even would have let him use the cheaper shipping method, but …

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Damn thats a purty host

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Updated pertinents at the bottom of the OP. I switched wires from 20ga to 22ga, also soldered star 2 for moon mode. Actually increased ground and got better output even with smaller wires! lol Ok, so I’ll have to avoid level 7…

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This build could probably be done better on an aluminum Eagle Eye X6 host. The Khatod 600 series optic is 35mm in diameter with an 11.8mm height so it’s about 3.2mm shorter than the CUTE-3 I’ve used in the past. The key to this optic is the wide opening that allows the XHP-50.2 to be used with the dome on. The extra 3.2mm height required for a copper spacer would be utilized to an extreme with the power this puts out. Richard has the Cutter T-Pad 32mm triple XM-XHP-50 triple MCPCB, as well as the emitters. He can also build the Zener modified FET to drive it on 2 cells.

I opened up the tail cap slightly to allow the back cell to fit further up into the tail cap and alleviate some spring pressure, also allowing the tail cap to thread on all the way. Similar can be done on the Eagle Eye hosts fairly easily. The legs on the Khatod optic have the post too long through the board, I filed those down to fit smooth on the back of the T-Pad board and it works out well. I supposed a standard spacer could be used and two extra 32mm Noctigons (or T-Pad’s) could be added under the main one for that 3mm stack height increase. Should be easy enough really for almost anyone to do it.

It’s an astonishingly bright build, looking forward to seeing some others give it a go and get their impressions… Wink

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DB Custom wrote:
My numbers are out the front, from the assembled light. On this one, the numbers given were at start on fresh charged cells.

Any hint on the source of discrepancy?
Heat?

DB Custom wrote:
Many people argue that this is misleading, but when you’re pulling 15+ Amps from a 650mAh 18350 , well, it’s a very steep slope. (24.41C…Yikes!)

Haven’t calculated that before…147 seconds until battery drainage. Though I guess at 120 W it would desolder before that. Wink
DB Custom
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Discrepency? What discrepency? djozz sets a C8 reflector on top of the emitter while it’s on a large heat sink and being driven by a power supply. Lab results, not real world. My numbers are in the flashlight, running on batteries, with an optic over the 3 emitters as run through an Zener modified FET driver. Not the same test at all. Not to mention a very large difference in equipment. djozz has some nice finds for his meters that would be difficult if not impossible to run across on demand…

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You never cease to amaze me with what you can build. Hope your surgery went well. My mom’s had back and neck surgery I know it can get rough.

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DB Custom wrote:
Discrepency? What discrepency? djozz sets a C8 reflector on top of the emitter while it’s on a large heat sink and being driven by a power supply. Lab results, not real world. My numbers are in the flashlight, running on batteries, with an optic over the 3 emitters as run through an Zener modified FET driver. Not the same test at all. Not to mention a very large difference in equipment. djozz has some nice finds for his meters that would be difficult if not impossible to run across on demand…

He has a more capable setup without optic and gets marginally better results. After substracting optic losses your light does ~18% more than my calculations predict. That’s why I asked if the results are OTF, your reported result was much closer to calculated LED lm then OTF lm.

That said, djozz doesn’t mention cooling the LED down between measurements, so I suspect that his LED is hotter than yours and that would be my first guess as to the reason why your light fares better. There might be some testing / calibration variance too. And my reading of the graph was rough which affects results. I wanted to know if there are other factors that could be at play…

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Oh wow thats bright Big Smile

Do you know the part nr on that khatod optic?
I got the urge to build something similar in a C8

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DB Custom wrote:
More images posted in the OP. Wink

+1…….. nice pics of an amazing light. Thanks for sharing

Im not a Pessimist …. just an Optimist with a lot of experience


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Very nice!!

Doesn’t these Cutter guys know who you are? Strange manner of acting, maybe link them to this topic?

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hahahahaha Miller, that’s hilarious! I’m nobody, sometimes even less than that. Wink

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