Does the Nichia die lie deeper than the XP-L die? I have a non-perfect beam with the D25A (XP-L HD to 219B) and wonder what I can do. Same in a BLF A6 where thinning the gasket and finally slicing the LED didn’t work out (eventually I replaced the reflector by a honeycomb optics to save the light and now using it as fill light). TIR optics would be ok for the Eagtac also if I can find one, but it would be great to keep the OPR. Sorry for OT, but I hope it fits in this discussion.
It probably does sit too high on mine but the reflector has a lip on it so it sits on the body of the light so sanding the spacer may not be enough unless you raise pcb too.
I do not use the imgur app on my phone
If I use my phone, I dont have access to posting images, only to creating “posts” that the horny idiots go crazy commenting about
this way I dont get any comments from the peanut gallery, note the choice for Images instead of Post
and yes, it is more complicated than reflowing an LED.. I take photo w phone, then email to my desktop, then load to imgur, then open in Preview and add text labels, then post to BLF… but photos still save me a TON of typing
Unheard wrote:
Does the Nichia die lie deeper than the XP-L die?…
I hope it fits in this discussion.
imo the problem is not the height. I think the beam shadow is caused by the larger opening at the base of the reflector
but to be fair, until we see the XP-L beam in a photo I reserve judgement whether the 219b is worse, or the reflector sucks for both
here is a comparison of an xml and xpg reflector in a sunwayman V10r Ti and V10r Ti+
here is an example of a stock xm-l2 and xpg beam in the sunwaymen..
xml2 has the shadow in the spill, even in stock form.. The xpg is much nicer.. (both beams retain the traits after modding to 219b)
the mod to the 2012 RRT-01 involves swapping in a reflector with a smaller hole at the bottom, which imo is key to beam success with that model
some examples of beam quality after modding, left is better (small hole reflector), right is worse
note that the xml reflector beam is has a shadow ring in the spill in both stock and modded form. People who are not whitewall hunters would never notice.
So, if I do a mod to a reflector with a wide hole at the bottom, I dont beat myself up when the beam is no better than stock.. it is still worth the High CRI upgrade, and for many applications I mainly use the hotspot, which is fine..
another view of large hole and small hole reflectors
I’ve seen worser artifacts in a beam than in the beam of my D25A, e.g. those of various Armyteks. Was never a problem since this was a property of the respective stock light. But when I modify a light and there’s something even barely wrong, it’s a drama. Maybe I’ll try a LH351D or a nice XP-L HD. The 219B always works in small lights like the Drop tools, and yes, the opening on those is very small. Just fits a Samsung. Very tight fit.
when I modify a light and there’s something even barely wrong, it’s a drama
same here
I get really nitpicky once I start modding
its the same when I take my car to a mechanic.. even if it only needs an oil change, when I get it back Im secretely hoping it has a new motor, more power, and better fuel economy too.. LOL
Ive spent a fortune on oil changes, and my car keeps getting older.. I still dont understand, so Im taking it in for another oil change soon
What’s the Low Voltage Warning like for the RRT01 Raptor?
Does it flash at 2.5V?
officially there is no LVP and no LVW, so you should use protected cells, or if you choose to use unprotected, do so responsibly, and check battery voltage periodically.
if you, or anyone else here, tests any model of RRT-01, please share what you learn
Im guessing they all flash at 2.5v, like my 2012 RRT-01 does:
I seek confirmation for your model
I recommend recharging LiIon cells before they drop below 3.2v, the LVW at 2.5v that I posted should not be relied upon as a recharging indicator..
Neal takes a while to respond sometimes but all the sudden you’ll get a tracking notice when it’s shipped. I got mine shipped june11 which was probably the first batch he got, the others prob went to vendors , i only got in because i had ordered a 2019 right before he listed as discontinued. Took a little over 2 weeks after shipping… quick for Corona standards…
Sit tight!
Found my stock xplhi beamshots before the 219b went in!
Btw my reylight cooper mini clicky 219b seems whiter than my sw45ks. Can someone tell me is this a thing or are my batch a warmer batch? I have a fireflies also is similar white rosy, so with 7 emitters, can't be a fluke?? Anyone know if those run cool? Were they cherry picked for that or maybe my small strip of sw45k run warm? Feedback? So, back to topic, the referred to reylight is pictured below on the right. 2020rrt01 w stock xplhi on left
Maybe i got lucky but i remember the beam being this un-ringy, hence the swap pretty good in that regard...
Stock 2020rrt01 vs swapped to sw40 fenix e20v2 shot indoors at workduring the day.
Here's a pic of the reflector, I'll take better pic when i get in there again to clean some stuff up. i would call it the big opening type with a snug fit up ring.
Here's two stand alone of my 2020 rrt01 after sw45k to compare with contractor's 2019s. (Both pretty low setting, maybe 30%.) When brighter, even less rings. There is a sweet spot i can dial in where i can see some rings from the centering ring to reflector boundary but they don't show up possibly because of my crude photographic method! Im trying! When i messed with white balance, things went south...
Contactor, were your 3 shots 3 different lights or different shots of the same light?
Im thinking the 2020 got new reflector/ other tidbits plus i got lucky.
PS. With this light, everything for swap was accessible from the bezel end... no coming up from underneath, is 2019 / earlier like that? Definitely no fitment issues on reassembly, except for needing to smush down my blobby solders. And pps. The centering ring such a tight fit, i had to remove reflow solder squeezeout for proper seating of the reflector assembly.
I wouldn’t bother with the 2019/20 reflector cause it gives perfect beam unlike 2012 even after upgrade.
What i did on one of my 2019 was that i’ve installed Yaijamei TIR instead. Beam vecame just a round hotspot without the spill. And in combination with swapped 351D 5000K instead of XPL-HI is awesome.
thanks for tip about that tir. my main complaint was that i didnt want a thrower or at least such a hot hot and weak spill. i also did not want to resort to dcfix or frosted lenses. but considered pebbled lens. i will likeley try that tir first, did it fit up well? have you looked at that fancy finnish reflector on darksucks site? wondered if that fit, but maybe its too similar to what we are already getting stock.
also, its a pretty mild AR if at all? did you add better AR lens?
I wouldn’t bother with the 2019/20 reflector cause it gives perfect beam unlike 2012 even after upgrade.
What i did on one of my 2019 was that i’ve installed Yaijamei TIR instead. Beam vecame just a round hotspot without the spill. And in combination with swapped 351D 5000K instead of XPL-HI is awesome.
I thought I saw this post somewhere but remind me what other changes you had to make. Did you have to get different o-ring or glass? I cant recall
Don't have this sucker with me now but if i'm not mistaken TIR is a tad narrower than reflector opening so you have to be careful when assembling bezel ring.
Lens fits snugly but it fits. Realy nice option to a reflector and i like big hotspot without any spill so i'd highly recommend.
It reminds me of Surefire Fresnel and Olight M2R Pro beams.
I tried a handful of TIRs with a 219B and they were just OK. I didn’t go above 15 degree TIR though. Half the ones I had did not fit at all. It seems the only ones that fit had the very small “lip” on the LED opening. The wide bottom ones did not go deep enough or would not sit straight.
However, I did try the reflector without the centering ring and it does get rid of the rings so I think sanding could focus the beam better in my case. My 2020 model is due here today so i’ll wait before I do anything drastic.
BurningPlayd0h called it. 4000K 70 CRI (the Nichia NW model)
The extensions are a better idea on paper than in reality. They are ugly and should have smoothed the top of one so you can have that against the ring. In 18650 form it’s hideous.
They used the too long clip (again)
Good:
The ring is SUPER smooth, A+
Light OP reflector is slightly larger and will be better for LED swaps
Barely noticeable detent on floor and ceiling
18350 seems like it’s decent resistance
It comes with an extra “gray” switch boot, wrench for clip, extra clip screws, and three O rings.
Double springs in tail switch
Neutral:
The bezel is slightly longer and the control ring is smaller by that amount
Tail stand wobble when off
All the silver parts are ever so slightly sand blasted
The anno doesn’t match 2019, it’s got a brown hue (this is annoying because you cant switch the head from 2020 to 2019 without noticing this)
Face down it’s hard to see if light is on, 2019 was only marginally better though
Reflector (without gasket): 21.62mm x 12.22mm
Lens: 22.81mm x 1.43mm
Lens coating adds -100K CCT and +0.0018 DUV
I used a rubber garden host washer to remove front bezel. Underside of mouse pad or similar can unscrew rear switch housing. MCPCB looks similar to 2019, between 12 and 13mm held in place with 2 small screws.
Yikes on cri! Double yikes on r9! This light seems made (at least destined) for swapping. They just threw in the two brightest pos’ they could find so they could write some big numbers, that also have all the brand recognition with em! Haha. Its like my fenix light with sst20. How bad could it be? It was really bad.
I was going to use rubber sheeting that i have at work to remove bezel but my calloused palms were sufficient. Only the pressure of the oring under the glass was holding mine in. The other side was a different story, i got inspired to try my strength on the control ring and cut up said palms.
Also interested in the tir spoken of earlier. Requesting post pic / link when you can please.
Edit-
After undoing bezel many times started with the rubber strips i cut from the sheeting. It’s a semi glossy stiff rubber approx 1/8 thick so it kind of creates a vacuum snd grips the bezel really well.
They just threw in… so they could write some big numbers
we think alike
they definitely game the system with the terms Neutral White Nichia
anyway… sales and politics aside.. really glad youre getting to swap some LEDs and experience the UI
hope it becomes useful in some niche of your use patterns, thanks for all the info and pics youre sharing
questions for anyone: is the 2020 reflector the same as the 2019? is the 2020 driver the same as 2019?
contactcr wrote:
Lens coating adds… +0.0018 DUV
woah!
I was not paying attention when you said that the first time
thats nasty, but interesting
whats the tradeoff if we remove the coating?
what percent of output lost?
what to use to strip AR coating?
is that too many questions? LOL
when I got sapphire lenses for some V11r, I noticed they seemed clearer (maybe just clean).. but they seemed to lack AR coating, no purple/blue/green reflection from the suface of the glass.
The reflector is definitely not the same, as the 2019 version was smooth and the 2020 in OP. Also, the 2020 has a bigger LED oppening and a different centering gasket is used. Finally, I did not put them next to each other, but believe that the 2020 reflector is larger in both dimensions. The 2020 creates a much smoother beam, with no rings or artifacts that I can see.
The driver is the same, I have both seen it and had it verified by Jetbeam that they have not changed the driver. It is a pity they did not take the opportunity to address the driver’s shortcomings.
An LED swap to Nichia 219b sw35 has created a far better and usable light than I ever expected, given the increased bulk.
Now, I am thinking of adding trits in the tail lanyard holes. They are too short for 6mm x 1.5mm trits but will fit 5mm x 1.2mm trits fine. Does anyone know the best method to do that, since the holes are open on both sides? I am thinking of running electrical tape on the inside, install the trits, cure the glue and removing the tape. Any better / tried methods?
Another interesting thing I noticed is the XP-L version of the new model apparently comes with a smooth reflector and Nichia this Light OP model. Nice that they created both if they are willing to sell parts down the road.
Does the Nichia die lie deeper than the XP-L die? I have a non-perfect beam with the D25A (XP-L HD to 219B) and wonder what I can do. Same in a BLF A6 where thinning the gasket and finally slicing the LED didn’t work out (eventually I replaced the reflector by a honeycomb optics to save the light and now using it as fill light). TIR optics would be ok for the Eagtac also if I can find one, but it would be great to keep the OPR. Sorry for OT, but I hope it fits in this discussion.
Smile, you cannot kill them all.
It probably does sit too high on mine but the reflector has a lip on it so it sits on the body of the light so sanding the spacer may not be enough unless you raise pcb too.
I do not use the imgur app on my phone
If I use my phone, I dont have access to posting images, only to creating “posts” that the horny idiots go crazy commenting about
this way I dont get any comments from the peanut gallery, note the choice for Images instead of Post
and yes, it is more complicated than reflowing an LED.. I take photo w phone, then email to my desktop, then load to imgur, then open in Preview and add text labels, then post to BLF… but photos still save me a TON of typing
imo the problem is not the height. I think the beam shadow is caused by the larger opening at the base of the reflector
but to be fair, until we see the XP-L beam in a photo I reserve judgement whether the 219b is worse, or the reflector sucks for both
here is a comparison of an xml and xpg reflector in a sunwayman V10r Ti and V10r Ti+
here is an example of a stock xm-l2 and xpg beam in the sunwaymen..
xml2 has the shadow in the spill, even in stock form.. The xpg is much nicer.. (both beams retain the traits after modding to 219b)
the mod to the 2012 RRT-01 involves swapping in a reflector with a smaller hole at the bottom, which imo is key to beam success with that model
some examples of beam quality after modding, left is better (small hole reflector), right is worse
note that the xml reflector beam is has a shadow ring in the spill in both stock and modded form. People who are not whitewall hunters would never notice.
So, if I do a mod to a reflector with a wide hole at the bottom, I dont beat myself up when the beam is no better than stock.. it is still worth the High CRI upgrade, and for many applications I mainly use the hotspot, which is fine..
another view of large hole and small hole reflectors
modded vs stock (small hole reflector)
stock vs modded (large hole reflector)
I’ve seen worser artifacts in a beam than in the beam of my D25A, e.g. those of various Armyteks. Was never a problem since this was a property of the respective stock light. But when I modify a light and there’s something even barely wrong, it’s a drama. Maybe I’ll try a LH351D or a nice XP-L HD. The 219B always works in small lights like the Drop tools, and yes, the opening on those is very small. Just fits a Samsung. Very tight fit.
Thanks for the pictures, Jon!
Smile, you cannot kill them all.
same here
I get really nitpicky once I start modding
its the same when I take my car to a mechanic.. even if it only needs an oil change, when I get it back Im secretely hoping it has a new motor, more power, and better fuel economy too.. LOL
Ive spent a fortune on oil changes, and my car keeps getting older.. I still dont understand, so Im taking it in for another oil change soon
What’s the Low Voltage Warning like for the RRT01 Raptor?
Does it flash at 2.5V?
officially there is no LVP and no LVW, so you should use protected cells, or if you choose to use unprotected, do so responsibly, and check battery voltage periodically.
if you, or anyone else here, tests any model of RRT-01, please share what you learn
Im guessing they all flash at 2.5v, like my 2012 RRT-01 does:
I seek confirmation for your model
I recommend recharging LiIon cells before they drop below 3.2v, the LVW at 2.5v that I posted should not be relied upon as a recharging indicator..
I ordered an RRT01 Raptor from Neal on 18th June. Unfulfilled.
Asked via FB on 28th June. No reply.
Asked again today, 6th July, in Chinese. Immediate reply
He’s waiting a few more days for a shipment from JETBeam. He paid them half a month ago.
Neal takes a while to respond sometimes but all the sudden you’ll get a tracking notice when it’s shipped. I got mine shipped june11 which was probably the first batch he got, the others prob went to vendors , i only got in because i had ordered a 2019 right before he listed as discontinued. Took a little over 2 weeks after shipping… quick for Corona standards…
Sit tight!
Found my stock xplhi beamshots before the 219b went in!
Btw my reylight cooper mini clicky 219b seems whiter than my sw45ks. Can someone tell me is this a thing or are my batch a warmer batch? I have a fireflies also is similar white rosy, so with 7 emitters, can't be a fluke?? Anyone know if those run cool? Were they cherry picked for that or maybe my small strip of sw45k run warm? Feedback? So, back to topic, the referred to reylight is pictured below on the right. 2020rrt01 w stock xplhi on left
Maybe i got lucky but i remember the beam being this un-ringy, hence the swap pretty good in that regard...
Stock 2020rrt01 vs swapped to sw40 fenix e20v2 shot indoors at workduring the day.
Here's a pic of the reflector, I'll take better pic when i get in there again to clean some stuff up. i would call it the big opening type with a snug fit up ring.
Here's two stand alone of my 2020 rrt01 after sw45k to compare with contractor's 2019s. (Both pretty low setting, maybe 30%.) When brighter, even less rings. There is a sweet spot i can dial in where i can see some rings from the centering ring to reflector boundary but they don't show up possibly because of my crude photographic method! Im trying! When i messed with white balance, things went south...
Contactor, were your 3 shots 3 different lights or different shots of the same light?
Im thinking the 2020 got new reflector/ other tidbits plus i got lucky.
PS. With this light, everything for swap was accessible from the bezel end... no coming up from underneath, is 2019 / earlier like that? Definitely no fitment issues on reassembly, except for needing to smush down my blobby solders. And pps. The centering ring such a tight fit, i had to remove reflow solder squeezeout for proper seating of the reflector assembly.
Jc
Thx for comparisson photoset.
I wouldn’t bother with the 2019/20 reflector cause it gives perfect beam unlike 2012 even after upgrade.
What i did on one of my 2019 was that i’ve installed Yaijamei TIR instead. Beam vecame just a round hotspot without the spill. And in combination with swapped 351D 5000K instead of XPL-HI is awesome.
WTB Titanium 4sevens 2xAA tube
thanks for tip about that tir. my main complaint was that i didnt want a thrower or at least such a hot hot and weak spill. i also did not want to resort to dcfix or frosted lenses. but considered pebbled lens. i will likeley try that tir first, did it fit up well? have you looked at that fancy finnish reflector on darksucks site? wondered if that fit, but maybe its too similar to what we are already getting stock.
also, its a pretty mild AR if at all? did you add better AR lens?
I thought I saw this post somewhere but remind me what other changes you had to make. Did you have to get different o-ring or glass? I cant recall
Don't have this sucker with me now but if i'm not mistaken TIR is a tad narrower than reflector opening so you have to be careful when assembling bezel ring.
Lens fits snugly but it fits. Realy nice option to a reflector and i like big hotspot without any spill so i'd highly recommend.
It reminds me of Surefire Fresnel and Olight M2R Pro beams.
WTB Titanium 4sevens 2xAA tube
I tried a handful of TIRs with a 219B and they were just OK. I didn’t go above 15 degree TIR though. Half the ones I had did not fit at all. It seems the only ones that fit had the very small “lip” on the LED opening. The wide bottom ones did not go deep enough or would not sit straight.
However, I did try the reflector without the centering ring and it does get rid of the rings so I think sanding could focus the beam better in my case. My 2020 model is due here today so i’ll wait before I do anything drastic.
2020 RRT01:
Bad:
Good:
Neutral:
Reflector (without gasket): 21.62mm x 12.22mm
Lens: 22.81mm x 1.43mm
Lens coating adds -100K CCT and +0.0018 DUV
I used a rubber garden host washer to remove front bezel. Underside of mouse pad or similar can unscrew rear switch housing. MCPCB looks similar to 2019, between 12 and 13mm held in place with 2 small screws.
good for general use, but terrible for illuminating art or for taking photos
I look forward to the details from id30209 on the pebble lens..
For a truly excellent beam with no Hotspot, I recommend the McGizmo Sundrop that uses an Aspheric lens
a similar beam for less dollars can be had from the
Klarus Mi1C aluminium with Aspheric lens
otherwise for lights without the focused hotspot of a single LED reflector light, consider a triple: FW3a
I do not recommend a Mule.. imo an Apheric beam is far superior.
oh well… patheticthanks for the measurements
proceed with LED swap of your choosing
Well that’s disappointing. Quite the screw up. I’m glad I gave it to my dad. He’s color blind, so it won’t matter to him.
Thanks for checking.
Jchang76 what did you use to get the bezel off the new one?
Edit; I used a rubber garden hose washer
Thank you very much for the tests contactcr, glad to see I’m not going colorblind and/or crazy.
Rough idea of what output you took the measurements at? If low, not surprised to see the positive duv but if near the top of the range that’s rough.
High, in the hot spot. I think you don’t notice as much cause the corona and spill are lower DUV and the hot spot on high is a bit bright up close.
Edit; I took out the lens and measured 4043K CCT and 0.0022 DUV so a non-AR lens would help too.
Edit2; 2020 version lens is 22.81mm x 1.43mm (or close enough) and fits pretty snug
I highlighted the CRI R9 (Red Spectrum) above.. its a negative number
negative R9 and positive R9 visualized as a Red Bar..
Negative R9 is Bad!
Yikes on cri! Double yikes on r9! This light seems made (at least destined) for swapping. They just threw in the two brightest pos’ they could find so they could write some big numbers, that also have all the brand recognition with em! Haha. Its like my fenix light with sst20. How bad could it be? It was really bad.
I was going to use rubber sheeting that i have at work to remove bezel but my calloused palms were sufficient. Only the pressure of the oring under the glass was holding mine in. The other side was a different story, i got inspired to try my strength on the control ring and cut up said palms.
Also interested in the tir spoken of earlier. Requesting post pic / link when you can please.
Edit-
After undoing bezel many times started with the rubber strips i cut from the sheeting. It’s a semi glossy stiff rubber approx 1/8 thick so it kind of creates a vacuum snd grips the bezel really well.
we think alike
they definitely game the system with the terms Neutral White Nichia
anyway… sales and politics aside.. really glad youre getting to swap some LEDs and experience the UI
hope it becomes useful in some niche of your use patterns, thanks for all the info and pics youre sharing
questions for anyone:
is the 2020 reflector the same as the 2019?
is the 2020 driver the same as 2019?
woah!
I was not paying attention when you said that the first time
thats nasty, but interesting
whats the tradeoff if we remove the coating?
what percent of output lost?
what to use to strip AR coating?
is that too many questions? LOL
when I got sapphire lenses for some V11r, I noticed they seemed clearer (maybe just clean).. but they seemed to lack AR coating, no purple/blue/green reflection from the suface of the glass.
The reflector is definitely not the same, as the 2019 version was smooth and the 2020 in OP. Also, the 2020 has a bigger LED oppening and a different centering gasket is used. Finally, I did not put them next to each other, but believe that the 2020 reflector is larger in both dimensions. The 2020 creates a much smoother beam, with no rings or artifacts that I can see.
The driver is the same, I have both seen it and had it verified by Jetbeam that they have not changed the driver. It is a pity they did not take the opportunity to address the driver’s shortcomings.
An LED swap to Nichia 219b sw35 has created a far better and usable light than I ever expected, given the increased bulk.
Now, I am thinking of adding trits in the tail lanyard holes. They are too short for 6mm x 1.5mm trits but will fit 5mm x 1.2mm trits fine. Does anyone know the best method to do that, since the holes are open on both sides? I am thinking of running electrical tape on the inside, install the trits, cure the glue and removing the tape. Any better / tried methods?
LED swap:
Shaved LH351D 5000K from AEDe’s last batch
I cut flat parts on the centering ring so it would not “rock” against screw heads and clear my solder blobs. It sits nice and even now.
The spare garden hose washer you get with sprayers and hoses to work with bezel.
Very nice result. This is on high, in hot spot, using stock glass. If I replaced the glass it would be even lower DUV.
lovely
thanks for the pics
do you know the percent change in output after swap?
Not sure about before, too ugly to measure. Now it’s ~640 lumens assuming my measuring stuff is remotely accurate after 9 months
thats a Lot of Lumens! maybe someone else can report the unmodified output.
2012 Original RRT-01, on my meter
sw45k
260 lumens
stock xml
390 lumens
the sw45k is 33% less bright than the stock xml, and I Love it!
Low Lumens need love as much as phat chicks do.
Another interesting thing I noticed is the XP-L version of the new model apparently comes with a smooth reflector and Nichia this Light OP model. Nice that they created both if they are willing to sell parts down the road.
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