KR1AA beam is looking good

[Tankolai (JJ)]

If the 2700K NTG50 is anything like the NTG35, I’d be interested in it as well. My only 3000K SFT70 is in a reflector light (L21B), but I’m pretty sure I might put it into a Hank like a KR1 or something.

Biggest reason I wanted the SFT-70 in the KR1AA is that I would think it would gain some throw over the NTG/5009R, but in this light it’d likely be negligible. However, I’m gonna get the SFT-70 anyway just to see. I don’t know what the NTG50 2700K is measuring at, but that 3500K 5FL009R was far too rosy for me. Jackson said it was at -0.022 iirc.

all of my 4000K (rosy) bin FL351A are rosier than any of my SW45K (none are D180 though) and a bit more magenta and less lavender if that makes any sense. the biggest problem with them imo is angular tint shift under TIR, but my NTG35 2700K has that problem too. I just put a floodier Carclo 10508/09/10/11 whichever is the frosted narrow spot. I have a single 4200K NTG35 and it’s identical to my eyes, maybe a tiny bit more rosy. could just be due to reflector and AR coating.

[jon_slider]

@Tankolai

Biggest reason I wanted the SFT-70 in the KR1AA is … throw
…
I don’t know what the NTG50 2700K is measuring at, but that 3500K 5FL009R was far too rosy for me. Jackson said it was at -0.022 iirc.

agree the SFT70 3000K has a throw advantage
but I dont like its 0.0006 tint. Im good w the NTG50 2700K Tint of -0.0096..

I agree 3500K FFL -0.0220 Tint is too extremely rosy..

The 10511 is the Frosted Narrow Spot on the D3AA on the right. The SFT70 3000K in KR1AA on left does throw more, it reaches the fence better (but makes the porch posts on bottom left more yellow):

My intended use for KR1AA w NTG 2700K is indoor evening and nightstand, so Tint below BBL is more important to me than throw.

I look forward to your impressions of the SFT70 3000K in KR1AA

[Tankolai (JJ)]

0.0006 DUV

honestly I didn’t think of that on the SFT-70. I do prefer rosy everywhere but I’m usually fine with neutral too. I don’t have any way to measure DUV other than my eyes. If there was a relatively inexpensive tool to do that I might get one.

ISO 200 F1.8 1/182s WB locked to 3800K
this is very close to what my eyes see with these lights indoors. by itself without these other emitters, the 219B in all my lights appears a little rosy. they’re all from Hank and Simon, pretty sure none are D200 or lower, but my D200 SW40K don’t appear much rosier.

[jon_slider]

@Tankolai

If there was a relatively inexpensive tool

there is not an inexpensive tool that is calibrated and accurate

that DUV data comes from someone with a ColorMunki, posted here, and includes a Tir over the LED. Its the most accurate data I could find to predict the Tint in a KR1AA.

there is a less expensive tool, but it is not calibrated, so the values it produces are not as accurate, although they serve to compare one LED Relative to another, in your own collection..

It is the tool Jackson uses, called Opple 4.. it can be off by as much as 0.0040 too low, but the inaccuracy range varies with different CCT.. it would let you assign a DUV number to each of the three beams you posted, (compared to each other on your own meter), but the actual numbers would not necessarily match a calibrated meter

there is also variation from one LED to another, of the same type, from the same reel.. DUV is a bit of a moving target ;-).. as are Lumens, which vary with battery level and also vary between individual LEDs.

Once you get your SFT70 3000K, you will be able to compare it to your own lights, and will be able to see if it is in fact less Rosy (more yellow or greenish).. even if you dont have a DUV meter.. you will know which LED is less Rosy

I will look forward to your comparison to the sw45k you have.. that would give me a pretty good idea how the SFT70 3000K looks.. relative to an LED Im familiar with..

Ultimately, we just have to buy and try the LEDs we think we will enjoy, and hope for the best.. there is a lot of speculation involved until we have an actual light in hand.

Photos are also very variable, depending on camera settings, and other light sources in the image

even my eyes change how much rosyness I perceive, depending on the ambient light at different times of day.

I have an Opple, but I mostly use it for my own relative comparisons between my own LEDs, I dont consider it accurate

and Ive also seen very large differences between any two LEDs of the same type

here is my own NTG35 4200K and my Opple’s DUV of -0.0087:

another use for the Opple.. before and after mod:

[Tankolai (JJ)]

I figured as much. I looked at getting an Opple 4 a year or more ago, because they were cheaper than the 3, but read that they were less accurate. I guess I’d forgotten about them for the most part. I can always at least trust the MK I eyeball with tint.

Ultimately, we just have to buy and try the LEDs we think we will enjoy, and hope for the best.. there is a lot of speculation involved until we have an actual light in hand.

This is exactly why I got into modding, when I got a Nichia 219 light, after having carried an SST-40 SC31 Pro for a while. Modding is something I enjoy greatly, even though I start more projects than I ever finish. Very grateful for all the information on here and similar forums.

However, I forgot that there was also a low-CRI 3000K SFT-70, right? Before ordering I will ask Hank and make sure he’s got the High-CRI version. The one I put in my L21B is high-CRI. I feel that there is no point for me to get low CRI unless it’s a pure thrower, but even that has changed these days with all these new LEDs.

[jon_slider]

@Tankolai

I forgot that there was also a low-CRI 3000K SFT-70, right?

no
the 3000K is the High CRI one
afaik the cooler ones are only available in Low CRI

one of the best size comparison pics Ive seen for the KR1AA:

[LedTed]

Reflector Comparisons - TS10 SG left and KR1AA.1 right.

[Light_Veteran]

Yes, but I hope Hank put the CULMN option or similar with spot optic. Maybe in 6V version?!

[jon_slider]

Hank’s KR1AA WebPage is UP!

It is not yet complete, unable to take orders, but we are one step closer

Merry Xmas!

[ryukin2000]

Sweet!

[ryukin2000]

The only 14500 cells I have were 2 that I bought a very long time ago. EVVA protected 800mah button top.these are very long and wouldn’t fit in my Utorch. I decided to remove the protection circuits to save some money on buying new. Underneath are Sanyos and from what I read they are 1.5A continuous discharge. This makes them under utilized for the KR1AA and D3AA?? Should I just buy higher discharge ones?

[jon_slider]

according to this review
outputs below step 7 use less than 1.5A:

and protection is built into the driver of the KR1AA (D3AA driver)..

you could disable Turbo and lower the ceiling to 120/150 and that would limit output to 500 lumens, so you never exceed the 1.5A CDR.

fwiw, I enjoy Lumintop 14500 Button Tops w USB-C, they have 4A CDR and are not longer than Eneloop. I still disable Turbo and lower the Ceiling to 120..

If Turbo is important to you.. suggest you consider Vapcel K10 batteries, they have 8A CDR.. (D3AA draws 5.65A max)

or if max capacity is a priority, consider Vapcel F15, they have 3A CDR.. brief Turbo wont hurt them, but again, I would disable Turbo..

fwiw my F15 button tops feel too tight (too long) for my Zebralight H53, otoh, my Lumintop 14500 fit easily.

If you have a 14500 Skilhunt it needs Button Top and wont work w Flat Top..

Lumintop Tool AA do not have built in protection in the driver. They need protected Button Tops.

Emisar D2 only work w Flat Tops (unless you request the Button Top Driver option)

you have choices.. depends what other 14500 lights you plan to use the batteries in

[ryukin2000]

Thanks Jon for the detailed reply. Turbo is nice to have but not a necessary. So steps 1-5 is the same performance as eneloop and 1 more is the furthest I can go with 1.5A CDR. I think I will buy new cells afterall. I’m sort of beating myself up because before I was able to use the button top for my four sevens QPA-X and after removing the protection circuit it no longer works with the light. I forgot it had raised bumps in the head for polarity protection. The only other light I have that takes 14500 is the UT01 but I am gifting that right away. The lumintop 14500 looks good and with convenient built in charging. Do I have to buy a light with it or can it be shipped separately? Alternatively I see that convoy is selling vapcell F15 and K10 cheaper than lumintop. $10cdn vs $13.68cdn lumintop.

On a positive note. I also had a dead protected 18650 that read 0V and wouldn’t take charge anymore.i removed the circuit as well just for the heck of it and when I measured the voltage after, it read 3.72. thew it in a light and it worked. I remember dropping the cell so it must have damaged the protection circuit.

[jon_slider]

@ryukin2000

can it be shipped separately?

yes.. Lumintop will sell the battery by itself
they will ship it in a free light, that I throw away..
I think Lumintop shipping is $8, you should confirm that (per shipment, not per battery).. so buying more than one Lumintop helps spread the shipping cost to other cells

I think Convoy shipping is a bit less, $4.60, you should confirm that too
they will also ship in a free light, that I throw away..

It will be cheaper to buy from Convoy than from Lumintop…

do the math including shipping and number of batteries, and then decide whatever you are most comfortable with

congrats on fixing your 18650, just make sure the light you use it in has protection in the driver

for my four sevens QPA-X and after removing the protection circuit it no longer works with the light

try to make sure that light wont have a problem with Vapcel button top length..

you also need to determine if the four sevens QPA-X needs a protected battery.. Vapcels are not protected, the Lumintop battery IS protected. My guess is the four sevens QPA-X Needs a protected battery, and does not have LVP in the driver.. you could ask darksucks if they know if that is correct.. You can also live dangerously and take personal responsibility to prevent draining an UnProtected battery below 2.7V

K10 and F15 button tops measure 51.3mm an Eneloop measures 50.1mm, a Lumintop is also 50.1mm..

whatever battery you use, needs to not stick up past the end of the body tube. it needs to sit below the end of the body tube by at least 0.2mm to allow for the compressed spring..

[Tankolai (JJ)]

I had a freebie Wurkkos WK04 with a very similar flat lens and I hated it, many artifacts. This is the reason I haven’t felt compelled to order the TS10SG yet.

Surely the beam from the TS10SG looks better though, right?

[ryukin2000]

“they will ship it in a free light, that I throw away..”

I was like say what?..then I read a review on them. Disgusting tint and just crappy overall. Now I get it haha.

[Tankolai (JJ)]

I have a few of those from different vendors. they’re nearly all 7000K+. one is probably close to 10000K, it’s so blue that it’s ridiculous. I’ve thought about trying to mod it, but why?

Compared to TS10v1 4000K (its emitters are a small bit green. edit: NOT rosy at all like the picture shows) locked at 4000K white balance:

Same thing, except white balance is locked at 10,000K:

another edit: this thing has quite old technology inside. just a plated brass strip for Batt+, but an actual thick tailspring. the LED dome is a hard plastic, and it kinda looks like the same one that comes in the decades old Novatac SPL-120, or in those junky cheap parts store light bars.

another edit: the tint in the 10,000K WB locked picture is how most of the freebies look, IME.

[Dc38 (The Glutton)]

I’ve settled on calling them “potato chip lights”.

[jon_slider]

@Tankolai

Surely the beam from the TS10SG looks better though, right?

The center of the beam is nice.. the perimeter of the beam does have artifacts and a shadow ring on a close wall:

In actual use, when my eyes focus on the hotspot, I dont find the imperfect spill beyond the shadow ring too distracting:

light set to 200 lumens, bench is 50 feet away

Does your KR1AA beam have a shadow ring around the center hotspot when shined on a close wall? Do you see artifacts in the spill?

[Tankolai (JJ)]

Thanks, it seems like this wouldn’t really be noticable while actually using the light instead of white wall hunting. Probably I will get one sooner or later.

I will have to check on the KR1AA beam in a while, but I don’t believe there are artifacts to the degree of the TS10SG. I do remember that if you’re paying attention you can see a slight square “corona” around the hotspot. I don’t think it’ll really show in a picture but I can get one later.

This could be different with a different emitter choice. I don’t know if it would be because there is more space in between the dies with the NTG50/FL5009R than the other available options in this light, like XHP50.3 or SFT-70 or others.

The FL5009R creates a donut hole without an orange peel reflector in my very limited experience. I just put one into an FW1A Pro this morning, and it doesn’t have a donut hole. It does in the smo reflector XT3