Three Oslons tested: 1) latest gen. Oslon Black Flat 2) SSL80 4000K 92CRI latest gen. 3) SSL80 4500K 96CRI 1 gen. before latest

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djburkes
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I use a hot plate and an old pan…works great for me.

Enderman
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I couldn’t use hot air, was too slow and not hot enough. Ended up using soldering pen old-lumens style.

The first time I reflowed it, the LED pads didn’t connect, so I tried again but forgot I rotated the PCB 180 degrees and accidentally soldered the LED backwards and blew it while testing xD
Luckily I bought 10 of them!
Next two LEDs I reflowed worked well.

I did two LEDs, since I only had two MCPCBs.
I was short on time, so the second LED (which I did a better reflow on) I only tested 3A-5A.
Here are the results:

As you can see, the second LED was reflowed a bit better and is getting higher output.
The X axis is amps, the Y axis is relative lux, so you just use that number for comparing. Ambient light was 7 on the y-axis.

As you can see, my large CPU heatsink with fan cooling and MX-4 thermal paste does not peak at 4.5A, or even 5A.
My power supply could not do over 5.2 but the output seems that it would keep going and peak at about 6-7A.
Very good results IMO, and driving it at 6A should give me even higher intensity than in DJozz’s tests since it won’t start dropping at 4.5A Big Smile
.
REMEMBER I measured this is just for me, since my “flashlights” use extreme cooling. For realistic results in a normal flashlight don’t pay attention to this graph Wink

djozz
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Nice results Enderman, well done!

The max at higher amps can also be explained by a better led, by accident or not. My led (just 1) was tested already 1.5 years ago, Osram may have improved the thermal properties in the meantime without officially calling it a new version. I say that because there is indeed a new version out, the Black Flat S, but just in multiled form, with better thermal performance. They may just used that improvement for the single die version too without telling.

Enderman
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djozz wrote:
Nice results Enderman, well done!

The max at higher amps can also be explained by a better led, by accident or not. My led (just 1) was tested already 1.5 years ago, Osram may have improved the thermal properties in the meantime without officially calling it a new version. I say that because there is indeed a new version out, the Black Flat S, but just in multiled form, with better thermal performance. They may just used that improvement for the single die version too without telling.


True, definitely the possibility of a better bin or revision.
What kind of cooling setup did you use in your tests?
My heatsink was at least 100W of cooling capacity, with a 120mm fan and copper plate and heat pipes.
MX-4 is also some of the best thermal paste that isn’t liquid metal.
.
In the actual flashlight build I will be using liquid metal, it even more heat conductive than solder Smile
I would totally buy a 7 or 8A buck driver from MTN electronics, if they had one Sad seems like the Black Flat could take it.
luminarium iaculator
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Thanks Mr. Enderman,
Properly re flowed and pressed led(solder as thin as possible) will perform better than one that is re flowed without press and has thicker solder layer between led and mcpcb. That is imho and ime and with classic lux meter test of same types of led I did years ago.

I am really interested how would they perform in single cell FET lights.

Mr. Enderman any chance you could start up group buy for this led? Or any of you guys of course?

djozz
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Enderman wrote:

What kind of cooling setup did you use in your tests?


luminarium iaculator
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Ha Smile Djozz is not joking when he does his test Thumbs Up

Enderman
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luminarium iaculator wrote:
Thanks Mr. Enderman,
Properly re flowed and pressed led(solder as thin as possible) will perform better than one that is re flowed without press and has thicker solder layer between led and mcpcb. That is imho and ime and with classic lux meter test of same types of led I did years ago.

I am really interested how would they perform in single cell FET lights.

Mr. Enderman any chance you could start up group buy for this led? Or any of you guys of course?


Yeah I did press the second LED down better, that could be it.
Either way it does seem like all the LEDs are the same bin like it says in the datasheet.

They will not be good for direct drive, unless you are ok with less current.
At 4.2v the LED only took 2.5A, and to get it to 5A it required 5v.
Direct drive with a single cell would make it run at ~2-2.5A which isn’t very high.
I recommend a CC buck driver for people who want to drive this LED hard.
(at least this is what the power supply showed me, I didnt have time to check it with a voltmeter)
On second though, the 3ft of wire might have made a difference, I bet the voltage drop at the LED is actually less than what the power supply showed.
Maybe like 1v less? that would be more similar to DJozz’s results…

djozz wrote:

Nice, I think my setup did provide better cooling than that since it didn’t have a huge copper column that heat had to travel through.
What thermal paste do you usually use?
djozz
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2.5A at 4.2V sounds far outside normal voltage variation for the Black Flat.

Enderman
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djozz wrote:
2.5A at 4.2V sounds far outside normal voltage variation for the Black Flat.

Yeah it was probably just the power supply.
Now that I know it won’t burn up I will do a test using my MTN max 6A driver and measure the voltage at the LED.
luminarium iaculator
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And build one small light with FET driver please Big Smile

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DTP friendly P channel MOSFET driver
17mm and bigger

did 17mm Oshpark
and 17-24mm Seeed design

luminarium iaculator
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Still no reply’s for this revolutionary driver?

Lexel when we can expect it and how much it will cost?

I see MCU there but is it possible that you individually re flash it for costumer demands (I need only Turbo, mid, low without memory effect so it always starts on high.

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The parts price will be around 1.3$ less than the other Narsil/Bistro drivers, as the FET is cheaper and no AMCs

The MCU can be Attiny 13a, 25 and 85 or other
Pin 3,5 and 6 are bridged to the single FET, so it is possible to run different 1 channel output firmwares

The_Driver
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@Djozz: thank you for testing the Black Flat two years ago! Because of you my big thrower now does 1.7Mcd. We all might have never noticed this LED if you hadn’t tried it.

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The_Driver wrote:
@Djozz: thank you for testing the Black Flat two years ago! Because of you my big Thrower now does 1.7Mcd. We all might have never noticed this LED if you hadn’t tried it.

You’re welcome. But my own first test in a Brinyte B158 made me believe that in practice this led was not so great as the test suggested. Must have been an imperfect reflow. Good that you guys went on with this led. Smile
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luminarium iaculator wrote:
Still no reply’s for this revolutionary driver?

Lexel when we can expect it and how much it will cost?

I see MCU there but is it possible that you individually re flash it for costumer demands (I need only Turbo, mid, low without memory effect so it always starts on high.

I got the first batch 17 and 20mm boards produced

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djozz wrote:
The_Driver wrote:
@Djozz: thank you for testing the Black Flat two years ago! Because of you my big Thrower now does 1.7Mcd. We all might have never noticed this LED if you hadn’t tried it.
You’re welcome. But my own first test in a Brinyte B158 made me believe that in practice this led was not so great as the test suggested. Must have been an imperfect reflow. Good that you guys went on with this led. Smile

Was it the same LED which you used for the test?

In what distance did you measure the light? You need to be further away compared to the same light with XP-G2 because the LED is smaller.

There might also be another reason. It’s possible that the lens of the Brinyte is not precise enough for such a small LED. You could check this by putting the light into full focus and looking straight at it from a few meters away. The entire lens needs to be yellow (or lit up).

If it’s not, then a fix would be to add a pre-collimator. It makes the LED seem twice as big which “makes it easier” for the lens.

djozz
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I measured at 7 meter, but an aspheric flashlight measures well at shorter distance just as well.

The Brinyte plastic lens is one of the best I have seen, and much better than any glass lens that I have encountered in various flashlights. The die image is very crisp, if the lens was imperfect you would see the imperfect focus coming from the lens part that gives different focus or chromatic abberations superimposed over the sharp die image. But you don’t see any of that.

Some recent testing with L4P’s Oslon board mafe me realise how sensitive specifically the overdriven Black Flat is for imperfect heatsinking, I really think that it is likely that something like that happened at the time.

The_Driver
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I agree, but you never know until you try ;).

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LichtAn wrote:
Which is the right one to order? What’s 5-pin vs. 2-pin?

https://www.arrow.com/en/products/luwhwqp-8m7n-ebvf46fcbb46-1/osram-opto-semiconductors

https://www.arrow.com/en/products/luwhwqp-8m7n-ebvf46fcbb46-8e8h/osram-opto-semiconductors


All the ones available on mouser and digikey are the 8E8H ones so go with that.
It also says new on arrow, so makes sense to buy the more recent one.
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Of course I ordered the wrong ones in a hurry. Facepalm

DB Custom
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So, having seen some interesting results from new builds with the Black Flat I just ordered my first ones. I’m thinking about putting 4 in the Sofirn Q8, any reason that won’t work? I don’t need this light to be a lumens boss, but a throwy performance might be very interesting…

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They have a very small tab on the outside of each pad, positive and negative, these make up for the 2 additional “pins” so they call it a 5 pin. It mounts the same as all the XP/Nichia/Samsung 3 slot footprints. Wink (got this on the data sheet)

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The flat black thermal pad is not isolated IIRC, so using it with the Q8 driver could short circuit.

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Not sure if it’s a good idea:
http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1216759#comment-1216759

That post is a question, maybe I’m missing something. But maybe Q8 reflector is not good for throw.

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Sofrin Q8 with XP-L HI is noticably throwier than the BLF Q8. I would expect the Black Flat to produce results of a similar nature.

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If the XP-L Hi in the Sofirn Q8 throws 106kcd, as I measured, a Black Flat should throw about 160 kcd, at ~2500 lumen OTF.

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If the grounded thermal pad is the only drawback, that can be dealt with. I have Arctic Alumina Thermal Adhesive to make a “mask” between the emitter shelf and MCPCB, I can make polycarbonate screws if need be to ensure the MCPCB doesn’t ground through the mounts. Or I can get ceramic screws. Or nylon ones, whatever. Don’t even need the screws if the MCPCB is glued down in the first place…

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