Lumileds Luxeon V, test of a 4000K 70CRI emitter

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djozz
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So it looks like the fault is in the die? The Luxeon V may be a double die led? Or so? And you can (partly) blow up one and the other keeps going.

Jerommel
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Maybe..
But the strange thing is that when you do a continuity test (polarity check / “beep” it) with a DMM the whole thing does light up like any other LED.
Only when you push more current through it (like 150mA or more), the problem becomes evident.

2Q19

ImA4Wheelr
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Now we're starting to cook with gas.  Thanks to Flashy Mike's and Jerommel's last contributions we know a lot more.  It looks kind of like a layer is not properly lined up.  Here is a diagram of some other type of chip scale package LED.  I like it because it gives a sense of how the electrical pads connect to the layers that create light and, therefore, how come these types of emitters are so much harder to fry (due to connection with no bond wires).

 

What doesn't jive with that possibility is that Jerommel had an LED that initially didn't manifest the failure.

EDIT:  Maybe the phosphor doesn't hold up well to the layer it is resting on that should normally be covered by another material.  So over time the defect reveals itself.

EDIT2:  I unpackaged my remaining 6 emitters and just momentarily tested them at 200mA.  None appeared to have the defect.  All 10 of my emitters are the 4K tint from Mouser.  I want to again thank Flashy Mike for taking one for the team to help gain insight into this issue.

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@ImA4Wheelr:
Thanks for your efforts, too.

Meanwhile I found my notes from my first tests with the Luxeon V. What I see there is a loss of about 33 to 36% both in max current and lumens after the damage occured – which is very close to a third. I have to concede that I’ve driven 2 of the LEDs pretty hard for test, up to 10 Amps which is not recommended at all. All LEDs have been ok on delivery, 2 went bad pretty fast, another one somewhat later in a light which has been driven with less current.
Btw. the highest lumen measurement I got (before the LEDs got damaged) was about 1800 lumens in a X3 at almost 10 Amps. Less than I expected.

djozz
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I measured just over 2000 lumen at 30 seconds in a Thorfire VG10, at 9A. Mind that my lumen is probably about 9% high compared to official calibrated measurements (and low compared to other BLF and flashlight manufacturer calibrations), so your 1800 lumen is quite similar.

ImA4Wheelr
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Flashy Mike wrote:
@ImA4Wheelr: Thanks for your efforts, too. Meanwhile I found my notes from my first tests with the Luxeon V. What I see there is a loss of about 33 to 36% both in max current and lumens after the damage occured - which is very close to a third. I have to concede that I've driven 2 of the LEDs pretty hard for test, up to 10 Amps which is not recommended at all. All LEDs have been ok on delivery, 2 went bad pretty fast, another one somewhat later in a light which has been driven with less current. Btw. the highest lumen measurement I got (before the LEDs got damaged) was about 1800 lumens in a X3 at almost 10 Amps. Less than I expected.

More great info.  It's probably way to tiny to detect, but do you see any signs of delamination (layers separating) on that dedomed emitter?

Blazer296
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How does the Luxeon V compare to the SST 40 as far as throw?

Flashy Mike
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Now I have a Luxeon V without phosphor left. It emits UV as I learned. Which wavelength should I expect?

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450nm (royal blue), UV is <400nm.

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Thanks. Is this valid for all white LEDs (with phosphor removed)? I could make royal blue LEDs by myself then (I ordered royal blue for my D4 RGBW, but they didn’t show up yet). Protection glasses not required, I guess?

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Are LED4POWER’s custom MCPCBs so far all there is for a good fit with these Luxeon V’s?

ImA4Wheelr
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Flashy Mike wrote:
Now I have a Luxeon V without phosphor left. It emits UV as I learned. Which wavelength should I expect?

My understanding is that most white emitters use a Royal Blue emitter (not sure of peak frequency at the moment).  There was an LED that was to center around 410nm by SORAA LED.  I don't know if it ever came out.  Here was a thread on it:

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/47709

Did you see my question in Post 127 above?

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Imagine Emisar D7 with 21700 Samsung 30T, copper sandblasted head, anodized aluminium sandblasted body, copper dtp board for 7 Luxeon V emitters together with Ledil ANNA 7up spot optics! Innocent

led4power
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Is D7 released light? I will probably make a new batch of mosX boards next month, I already have few boards that I'd like to make,if there is enough interest I can add few other designs.

PH_Oton
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D7 is not yet released but as far as I know it should use 3×18650 and 7 emitters I suppose judging by name. I would love to see 21700 design though! In my opinion Emisar series should be single cell lights and Noctigon series multiple cell. I hope we will find out soon what D7 will look like!

I would love to see 7 luxeon V mosx boards compatible with Ledil ANNA! It’s the way to go. I am very optimistic in believing that in 2018th we will se more 20700 and 21700 single cell flashlights.

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Btw I’ve built S2+ triple luxeon V with your parts led4power. I saw 16.2A with my Uni-T UT58E with extra thick 3.6mm short speaker wires and vtc5a. Output is insane.
Should be 5500 led lumens being on a conservative side. If 20% is lost (I am not using lens in front if optic and I I grinded lip to have optic and exposed as much as possible) I should be getting 4400 lumens OTF Party

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ImA4Wheelr wrote:
It’s probably way to tiny to detect, but do you see any signs of delamination (layers separating) on that dedomed emitter?
Sorry, missed that question. Apart from what I wrote earlier, I couldn’t detect anything unusual.
nitroz
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It looks like the Lux V boards are out of stock. Any ETA?

led4power
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~1week (new 16mm and 20mm).

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led4power wrote:

~1week (new 16mm and 20mm).

Thx!

alberto7
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Whats its the recomended center gasket for this led in a convoy s2+ (7mm opening reflector)?

led4power
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nitroz wrote:
led4power wrote:

~1week (new 16mm and 20mm).

Thx!

 

I forgot to update status in this thread; DTP PCBs are available now:

https://led4power.com/product-category/mcpcbs/copper-dtp/

 

djozz
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alberto7 wrote:
Whats its the recomended center gasket for this led in a convoy s2+ (7mm opening reflector)?

You will have to adjust one, I reamed a XP gasket with one of these:
Edness
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I’m still waiting for my order from led4power. Hoping it’ll get here soon to see what the hype’s about. LOL

PH_Oton
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I just came from outside. Had a bit of fun Innocent

djozz
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Cool pic! Cool

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Ordered a triple and a quad 4040 mcpcb with luxeon v 4000k.

Triple went into a S2+ and quad in the D4. This emitter made them flood monsters! The triple pulls 17A with a vtc5a!

PH_Oton
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Edness wrote:
Ordered a triple and a quad 4040 mcpcb with luxeon v 4000k.

Triple went into a S2+ and quad in the D4. This emitter made them flood monsters! The triple pulls 17A with a vtc5a!

It really puts every other triple and quad into shame in terms of total output to tint ratio, doesn’t it?
What I noticed though is that to some people triple dedomed xp-g2 is more impressive due to a lot more throw and still quite a lot of spill that spreads near your toes although it greatly depends on area where you are using lights.

Mike C
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Edness wrote:
This emitter made them flood monsters!

Yeah, I got a M2 quad with these. Love the tint, but flood monster it is!
khas
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My most used Luxeon V is starting to show signs of the abuse it has been through, there is a dead spot in the center of the emitter.

It has been in many different hosts before ending up in a Sofirn C8 and used extensively as my “walking the dog” flashlight. It has always been used with high drain batteries and FET drivers.

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