Texas_Ace BLF Calibrated Lumen tube / Sphere No math skills needed - Several spheres still available

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JasonWW
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Maukka, what type of sphere are you currently using? I assume it’s a high dollar professional unit?

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

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emarkd wrote:
While we’re all bouncing factory numbers around don’t forget that the variation among LEDs in any single flux bin is something like 12 or 15%, so Nitecore may say a light makes 1000 lumens but each light made will actually vary along a range of output depending on the efficiency of that specific LED and where it falls in that bin range. The only way that I can think of to calibrate these tubes to within less than the binning variation is to either sample many many many specimens of the same light and average them, or better yet to compare the tube’s readings against a NIST-calibrated sphere using the same exact light source, not another specimen of the same model. …which is what I tried to do using the HDS lights because supposedly they do that for each individual light sold.

Exactly what I have been preaching for years, the 14% tolerance from Cree on their LED’s inherently means you can’t get better then that without a ton of measurements.

On top of that you have the tolerances of all the components on the drivers, while 1% is common for some things 5% and even 10% is common others. Also the tolerances can compound on each other depending on how the driver is setup.

So 5-10% for the driver / rest of the light fluctuation and you can easily have a 20-25%+ variance strictly due to the tolerances of the components in the light. Then you have the environment factors, this can be seen more with throw readings at distance but it will still play a role in the tube readings. I can see a few lumen change in readings on very humid days vs dry ones.

JasonWW
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maukka wrote:
I use a 50cm Lisun sphere.

That is for your job, right? You don’t buy all your specialized equipment just for hobby use.

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SKV89
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Texas_Ace wrote:
emarkd wrote:
If I find time today I think I’ll try layering some DC Fix in mine, unless someone has tried it already. More diffusion, plus reduction. Might take several layers but worth a shot. The stuff is cheap, ~12 bucks a roll from amazon and I’ve got plenty of it here.

This is an option I was considering for a fix-all solution. Or some other similar film. Possibly cut out some acyrlic discs to fit in the hole the sensor goes and then add layers of the DC fix to it until the readings are correct. People can then install it. Although I have not figured out a good method for that yet.

Glue works but can also change the readings.

I’m curious why can’t we just apply a factor in the settings of the lux meter. Isn’t that how you calibrated them in the first place?

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SKV89 wrote:
I’m curious why can’t we just apply a factor in the settings of the lux meter. Isn’t that how you calibrated them in the first place?

There is no calibration factor on the lux meters. The tubes are (supposed to be) physically calibrated with diffusing material so 1 lux = 1 lumen on the meter. Fixing them will require physical modification to correct the calibration.

SKV89
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Oic. i always thought TA modified the settings of the lux meter to apply a calibration factor.

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SKV89 wrote:
Oic. i always thought TA modified the settings of the lux meter to apply a calibration factor.

Oh, if only it was that simple, the last month of work would of only taken about a week lol.

Each sphere had to be individually “calibrated” by changing things like what diffusing sheets, how many, what direction they pointed, adding or removing reflective tape ect. All of them were different for reasons I can not explain. Not massively different but enough to cause each one to need a unique setup.

In this case since we only want to reduce the lux on the meter and we are not worried about diffusing the beam and making it even, we can put something just over the meter that should not suffer the wide variances.

The question is what to put there. DC fix is a possible option.

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maukka wrote:
Here’s new output numbers for Nitecore EC4SW and MH20. Both with full 30Qs. Measured first on high, then on turbo, so the turbo numbers aren’t with absolutely topped off cells, since I had the high on for about 40 seconds. I did let the light cool off a couple of minutes though.

Seems my small styrofoam sphere I used when originally tested these was reading about 8-9% low. Still I think a 10% error margin is quite good for DIY integrating devices.

Nitecore EC4SW
High 0 sec: 860 lm
High 30 sec: 850 lm
Turbo 0 sec: 1738 lm
Turbo 30 sec: 1667 lm

Nitecore MH20 NW
High 0 sec: 497 lm
High 30 sec: 500 lm
Turbo 0 sec: 932 lm
Turbo 30 sec: 890 lm


Thanks a lot! I’ll redo the calculation, then fine tune the calibration# when I got time!
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I cant wait to get my tube.. i got many lights.. my main testing with be stock lights and skylumen lights.. i will be testing variety of lights, small, big, flood, and thrower.

Stock lights

Emisar d4 quad
Emisar d1s
Blf q8
Lumintop odf30
Thrunite tc20
Thrunite catapult v6
Fenix Tk35ue
Acebeam L16
Noctigon m43

Modded skylumen

Tn42vn90
Tn42vn olson
Olight x7
Mateminco mt18
Manker u21 olson
Acebeam k60
Acebeam x45
Notcigon m43

Will test more along the way…

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Texas_Ace wrote:

In this case since we only want to reduce the lux on the meter and we are not worried about diffusing the beam and making it even, we can put something just over the meter that should not suffer the wide variances.

The question is what to put there. DC fix is a possible option.

So to reduce the amount of light hitting the sensor to re calibrate, the extra diffusing material needs to be right at the sensor? Isn’t there a diffuser plate near the front where we place the light? (I haven’t received mine yet so I haven’t seen it) Couldn’t we just add more diffusion material there?

I suppose when I get the tube (ETA Monday) it would be best to take measurements with ANSI rated lights? I have some Eagletacs I can try that have ANSI specs listed. Also is there one light that most of us own the same model we could be test to between us to compare, such as Q8?

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JasonWW wrote:
maukka wrote:
I use a 50cm Lisun sphere.

That is for your job, right? You don’t buy all your specialized equipment just for hobby use.

It’s here sitting in my living room, thankfully I have an understanding wife…
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maukka wrote:
JasonWW wrote:
maukka wrote:
I use a 50cm Lisun sphere is for your job, right? You don’t buy all your specialized equipment just for hobby use.
It’s here sitting in my living room, thankfully I have an understanding wife…
Wow!! She is definitely a keeper…… Thumbs Up .. Smile

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beam0 wrote:
Texas_Ace wrote:

In this case since we only want to reduce the lux on the meter and we are not worried about diffusing the beam and making it even, we can put something just over the meter that should not suffer the wide variances.

The question is what to put there. DC fix is a possible option.

So to reduce the amount of light hitting the sensor to re calibrate, the extra diffusing material needs to be right at the sensor? Isn’t there a diffuser plate near the front where we place the light? (I haven’t received mine yet so I haven’t seen it) Couldn’t we just add more diffusion material there?

I suppose when I get the tube (ETA Monday) it would be best to take measurements with ANSI rated lights? I have some Eagletacs I can try that have ANSI specs listed. Also is there one light that most of us own the same model we could be test to between us to compare, such as Q8?

Yes, there are 3-4 diffusers in the tube actually. They lower the readings on the meter and mostly spread out the light so it is even and beam pattern does not effect the readings. This is a major problem with this design if you do not have the diffusers in place.

The problem is that even a minor change to the ones at the start of the tube can have big effects by the time it hits the meter, which is why it was so hard to calibrate them.

By putting the new one right at the sensor it should have the same effect across all the spheres.

Although naturally I will test several methods when it comes time for that.

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Okay thanks for explaining.

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"27,157 results for zoomable flashlight" (ebay)

 

 

SKV89
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maukka wrote:
JasonWW wrote:
maukka wrote:
I use a 50cm Lisun sphere.
That is for your job, right? You don’t buy all your specialized equipment just for hobby use.
It’s here sitting in my living room, thankfully I have an understanding wife…

Holy cow you cant be serious right? That thing is HUGE!

JasonWW
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SKV89 wrote:
maukka wrote:
JasonWW wrote:
maukka wrote:
I use a 50cm Lisun sphere.
That is for your job, right? You don’t buy all your specialized equipment just for hobby use.
It’s here sitting in my living room, thankfully I have an understanding wife…

Holy cow you cant be serious right? That thing is HUGE!


50cm is about 20 inches. So not huge. I’m sure it’s expensive, though. Plus he’s got all that spectral analysis equipment. I assumed he worked in a lab or something and used their equipment in his off time. Smile

Texas Ace Lumen Tube calibrated with Maukka lights

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I heard those sphere cost about $10000..

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My 4” light tube wasn’t that far off but I did have to make an adjustment, now its reading pretty much spot on to my stock Surefire and Malkoff lights with known out put. Tested 10 Surefire and 10 Malkoff’s all lights have Constant current drivers and the spec’s are easy enough to check online. The repeatability is amazing

A couple of examples… a Malkoff Hound Dog NW 1000 ansi lumens..

Malkoff Hound Dog CW 1100-1200 ansi lumens

All it took was a piece of Walmart white plastic bag stretched over the light meter Thumbs Up

I tested a few of Randy Brogden’s PFlexPro lights that he tested… pretty much Spot On!

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KawiBoy1428 wrote:
My 4” light tube wasn’t that far off but I did have to make an adjustment, now its reading pretty much spot on to my stock Surefire and Malkoff lights with known out put. Tested 10 Surefire and 10 Malkoff’s all lights have Constant current drivers and the spec’s are easy enough to check online. The repeatability is amazing

A couple of examples… a Malkoff Hound Dog NW 1000 ansi lumens..

Malkoff Hound Dog CW 1100-1200 ansi lumens

All it took was a piece of Walmart white plastic bag stretched over the light meter Thumbs Up

Yes, the repeatability was the key reason I spent 6 months perfecting this design. Without the diffusing sheets the numbers would vary by large amounts even with just a few mm of movement and throwers got a large advantage as well.

Glad to see with minor adjustments the results fall in line, I am thinking that the idea of putting something on the sensor end could be a fairly simple fix for everyone and would be possible for me to ship to everyone without a large expenditure on my end.

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Texas_Ace wrote:
KawiBoy1428 wrote:
My 4” light tube wasn’t that far off but I did have to make an adjustment, now its reading pretty much spot on to my stock Surefire and Malkoff lights with known out put. Tested 10 Surefire and 10 Malkoff’s all lights have Constant current drivers and the spec’s are easy enough to check online. The repeatability is amazing

A couple of examples… a Malkoff Hound Dog NW 1000 ansi lumens..

Malkoff Hound Dog CW 1100-1200 ansi lumens

All it took was a piece of Walmart white plastic bag stretched over the light meter Thumbs Up

Yes, the repeatability was the key reason I spent 6 months perfecting this design. Without the diffusing sheets the numbers would vary by large amounts even with just a few mm of movement and throwers got a large advantage as well.

Glad to see with minor adjustments the results fall in line, I am thinking that the idea of putting something on the sensor end could be a fairly simple fix for everyone and would be possible for me to ship to everyone without a large expenditure on my end.

I will gladly pay to help defray what ever cost you may incur to deliver a fix that makes all the tubes more accurate and consistent with each other

Texas_Ace
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shirnask wrote:
Texas_Ace wrote:
KawiBoy1428 wrote:
My 4” light tube wasn’t that far off but I did have to make an adjustment, now its reading pretty much spot on to my stock Surefire and Malkoff lights with known out put. Tested 10 Surefire and 10 Malkoff’s all lights have Constant current drivers and the spec’s are easy enough to check online. The repeatability is amazing

A couple of examples… a Malkoff Hound Dog NW 1000 ansi lumens..

Malkoff Hound Dog CW 1100-1200 ansi lumens

All it took was a piece of Walmart white plastic bag stretched over the light meter Thumbs Up

Yes, the repeatability was the key reason I spent 6 months perfecting this design. Without the diffusing sheets the numbers would vary by large amounts even with just a few mm of movement and throwers got a large advantage as well.

Glad to see with minor adjustments the results fall in line, I am thinking that the idea of putting something on the sensor end could be a fairly simple fix for everyone and would be possible for me to ship to everyone without a large expenditure on my end.

I will gladly pay to help defray what ever cost you may incur to deliver a fix that makes all the tubes more accurate and consistent with each other

I will most likely take you up on that. When I get to a point of having a fix figured out feel free to message me. It will most likely be a few weeks so I will have lost this post by then I am sure lol.

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hi kiwi, can you tell us what adjustment do you make on your 4” tube ? Thanks.

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What is the red indictator by the tube?? What does it do?

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Man Without Shadow wrote:
It’s his lighted mouse wheel

Thanks.. kiwi is bitter !

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Newlumen wrote:
hi kiwi, can you tell us what adjustment do you make on your 4” tube ? Thanks.

He stretched a white plastic bag from a local store over the sensor. Very similar to what I did using some wax tissue paper.

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Newlumen wrote:
hi kawi, can you tell us what adjustment do you make on your 4” tube ? Thanks.

I put brand new batteries in the Meter ( I have had low/crappy batteries give me High Lux readings before) and after many hours of trying different materials …..I tried the Walmart white plastic bag…. 1 layer stretched over meter shoved into the end of the tube Big Smile

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KawiBoy1428 wrote:

Just curious, is the hole in the centering ring just perfectly sized for this light so only the very edge of the bezel is resting on it? (not blocking any of the reflector area)

I thought we had to hold the light through the hole, starting at roughly flush then move it up and down.

Texas_Ace wrote:
You will simply hold it roughly flush with the centering ring, move it up and down until you get the best reading.

"Over 2000000 hours (about 200 years) standby time"  (DQG Tiny 4th)

"27,157 results for zoomable flashlight" (ebay)

 

 

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