Luminus SFT40 test

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Sivy
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Will34 ,Well worth putting in a C8
I did like you say to upgrade from XPL HI with X5/X6 driver ,thinking a mild uplift in power/throw ,but it’s much better than I expected , now my best C8 thrower overtaking my old champ ,C8+ with a CSLNM1 @ 5amp by quite a bit ,maybe 25% better

Sirstinky
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MoreLumens wrote:
Oh why they always offer the most ugliest CCT’s first. Also in what lightning applications they use those? I’m kinda tempted to use those in EC03, but not sure if I can handle my eyes bleeding. Probably not. Wink

They like 6500k because those bins are usually the brightest-lumens sell better than beam quality, remember? The majority of buyers of these are probably manufacturers of optocoupling instruments (like fiber optic stuff, optical scopes, lighting, endoscope, etc) or display illumination, automotive, and so forth. Cars mainly use cool white stuff for accent lighting (or DRLs). That’s mainly where domeless LEDs go anyway…they make the most of what they sell the most, so go figure.

Th558
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The SFT40 can be pushed close to it’s limit with just one cell so it would probably outthrow the SBT90.2 in a single cell light. For multi cell light the SBT90.2 seems the better choice though it is also more expensive.

JaredM
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I’d expect about 180kcd from a C8+ SFT40.

TomE, how many amps on the BOSS mod? I think it’s easy to over current this emitter looking at the Vf.

And according to my calculations, SFT40 may outthrow a 90.2 by 5% when both are at their peak. In the real world, the SFT likely pulls a meaningful margin at 30s in anything but massive, multicell lights.

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Tom E
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On the BOSS1 with just 1 GOLISI cell, I measured 9.5 amps at 4.12V. Fully charged for the test, it must be higher -- see I didn't note it, so probably didn't measure it. I backed off from using 4 26650's which the BOSS1 is capable of, afraid I'd be past the peak with amps. It's an insane light to say the least, massive, the handle is really quite handy for it, not just for heat but to hold it in one hand.

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Got it. 9.5A is ideal IMO. Wouldn’t be surprised if your posted numbers are a bit overdriven w/ 4 cells.

I’m going to try and resistor mod Simon’s ramping driver to 9.5A and see if it in fact uses a TINY13A and customize a UI.

Current plans for this emitter to live in:

TN31 R-mod
Supfire M6 w/ MTNe driver
B158
Convoy M2
L21B (stock)

Anyone with a FF E01 to try this swap ? Curious how that TIR works with this emitter. Astrolux EA01 would be interesting too.

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Tom E
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I have an FF E01, yep, might be interesting.

The #'s posted were just on the single GOLISI. Think the 4 EFEST test was slightly lower results. Yea, could have been over the top, or the old EFEST's lost some power over the years, not sure.

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I found the SFT40 on a mcpcb for sale. But I can’t find a driver for it. Any recommendations for 8-9 amps? Also, where to buy? (sorry, I’m a noob) Constant current/single mode is OK. I don’t need extra features. I’m also planning to run with an off-line power supply instead of batteries, if that makes a difference.

Dr scott Diabolical - Evil Genius

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Hmmm, thanks for the testing djozz. Maybe Nitecore will use these on their next iteration of P12 and MH series. Would certainly be amazing. Hopefully they bring back the guarded tail-switch and the amazing rubber mode button in the next P12. The P12GT was absolutely perfect and every iteration after that has sucked. Exposed tail-switches (that’s less of a gripe, I can live with a light that can’t tailstand but meh), and the part where they REALLY messed up was in the side switch (which is also the on/off button on their lights without a tail-switch). That button is nearly impossible to find in the dark. It’s the same color as the rest of the light and you can’t feel it. Anyway, this LED seems promising. Might just try modding my old P12GT with this… after I get it fixed that is. I think the P12GT uses a MOSFET driver, would this LED work with that? (I’ve never modded a light before, newbie here so be easy on me Silly ) I know Nitecore uses a lot of proprietary components and they’re a pain to get open, etc. (saw a thread once where someone opened up a P12GT, wish I had the link). Maybe I should just get a C8 and play with that first.

I see it being compared to the SBT 90.2, are they that similar? I have a Thrunite Catapult V6 and that has an XHP35 HI in it, would the SFT40 be a good upgrade for it? I can already see how modding lights can be a rabbit hole into which I could easily fall…

I just like shining my lights into the dark out of pure enjoyment and awe.
We've come far technologically and it's crazy to imagine what the future holds.

niajef
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Neurotoxin wrote:
I see it being compared to the SBT 90.2, are they that similar? I have a Thrunite Catapult V6 and that has an XHP35 HI in it, would the SFT40 be a good upgrade for it? I can already see how modding lights can be a rabbit hole into which I could easily fall…

exact same question and scenario for me too…

kaTz21
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Had it on my Convoy Z1, looks very bright and great laser beam!

g_damian
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I put SFT-40 in BLF A6 and in WildTrail D80v2. I measured almost 27kcd throw from BLF A6 with SFT-40. 116kcd from D80v2.

Details are in “What did you mod today” thread

ArtieT59
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niajef wrote:
Neurotoxin wrote:
I see it being compared to the SBT 90.2, are they that similar? I have a Thrunite Catapult V6 and that has an XHP35 HI in it, would the SFT40 be a good upgrade for it? I can already see how modding lights can be a rabbit hole into which I could easily fall...
exact same question and scenario for me too...

 

They are not that similar, except in their luminance (candela / sqaure mm), and their beam profile looks similar regarding the large hot spot. the sft40 is a great upgrade

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

Tom E
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ArtieT59 wrote:

niajef wrote:
Neurotoxin wrote:
I see it being compared to the SBT 90.2, are they that similar? I have a Thrunite Catapult V6 and that has an XHP35 HI in it, would the SFT40 be a good upgrade for it? I can already see how modding lights can be a rabbit hole into which I could easily fall...
exact same question and scenario for me too...

 

They are not that similar, except in their luminance (candela / sqaure mm), and their beam profile looks similar regarding the large hot spot. the sft40 is a great upgrade

I was comparing triple SFT-40's with a single SBT90.2, but 1:1 comparison, the SBT90.2 at 5700K has a better temp (warmer) and better tint, less green. I still think in raw throw (kcd), they are very close when both are driven hard (SFT-40 about 9 amps, SBT90.2 about 20-24 amps), and for those extra amps you get more lumens with the SBT90.2. They are both 3V, but a XHP35 HI is 12V, so a straight emitter swap in a 12V LED light is out of the question - more serious modding is needed.

Neurotoxin
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ArtieT59 wrote:
They are not that similar, except in their luminance (candela / sqaure mm), and their beam profile looks similar regarding the large hot spot. the sft40 is a great upgrade

Hmm not that similar how? Is there a size difference or is it just the voltage difference, being that the XHP35 HI is 12V and the SFT40 is 3V? Thanks for mentioning it’s a great upgrade Smile Now I’m even more interested. Will likely end up doing it once I learn more. I’ll of course post it on the forum if I do, so that others may do the same if they wish.

Tom E wrote:
I was comparing triple SFT-40’s with a single SBT90.2, but 1:1 comparison, the SBT90.2 at 5700K has a better temp (warmer) and better tint, less green. I still think in raw throw (kcd), they are very close when both are driven hard (SFT-40 about 9 amps, SBT90.2 about 20-24 amps), and for those extra amps you get more lumens with the SBT90.2. They are both 3V, but a XHP35 HI is 12V, so a straight emitter swap in a 12V LED light is out of the question – more serious modding is needed.

Ok, so I’d basically just have to change out the board for another one that’s 3V and install the emitter there yes? So for example, buy an SFT-40 or SBT-90.2 and also get a suitable, 3 volt board and then just install the LED on the board and solder that to my flashlight? Or do these LED’s come preinstalled in suitable boards that I could just “drop in” my flashlight? Basically remove the old one, and solder the replacement in. The SFT-40 would be easier to drive on a single cell light like my Catapult V6, but I do know of a 26650 cell that outputs crazy current (like 45 amps) that I could purchase if I did go the SBT route.

I just like shining my lights into the dark out of pure enjoyment and awe.
We've come far technologically and it's crazy to imagine what the future holds.

ArtieT59
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Neurotoxin wrote:
ArtieT59 wrote:
They are not that similar, except in their luminance (candela / sqaure mm), and their beam profile looks similar regarding the large hot spot. the sft40 is a great upgrade
Hmm not that similar how? Is there a size difference or is it just the voltage difference, being that the XHP35 HI is 12V and the SFT40 is 3V? Thanks for mentioning it's a great upgrade Smile Now I'm even more interested. Will likely end up doing it once I learn more. I'll of course post it on the forum if I do, so that others may do the same if they wish.
Tom E wrote:
I was comparing triple SFT-40's with a single SBT90.2, but 1:1 comparison, the SBT90.2 at 5700K has a better temp (warmer) and better tint, less green. I still think in raw throw (kcd), they are very close when both are driven hard (SFT-40 about 9 amps, SBT90.2 about 20-24 amps), and for those extra amps you get more lumens with the SBT90.2. They are both 3V, but a XHP35 HI is 12V, so a straight emitter swap in a 12V LED light is out of the question - more serious modding is needed.
Ok, so I'd basically just have to change out the board for another one that's 3V and install the emitter there yes? So for example, buy an SFT-40 or SBT-90.2 and also get a suitable, 3 volt board and then just install the LED on the board and solder that to my flashlight? Or do these LED's come preinstalled in suitable boards that I could just "drop in" my flashlight? Basically remove the old one, and solder the replacement in. The SFT-40 would be easier to drive on a single cell light like my Catapult V6, but I do know of a 26650 cell that outputs crazy current (like 45 amps) that I could purchase if I did go the SBT route.

 

I apologize i was in a rush and didnt finish my thought. the sft40 is aa good upgrade, but it is similar to the xhp35 HI in its design and beam shape. BUT - MORE Importantly - and to further TomE's point, you cannot just drop a sbt90.2 or sft40 in that catapult. and there is no "board" replacement like you were aksing about, it requires chaging the DRIVER in that Catapult so you can run the sbt90 or sft40, or any other 3 volt emitter for that matter. The xhp35 Hi is a 12 volt only emitter, so the driver running voltage is different. so that mod is more involved becasue well you have to find an appropriate driver first (not too hard) bu tthen remove the driver and set the new one in. its more of a pain, and that catapult with xhp35 HI is a pretty nice light, i would say this. 

 

Your better off doing what im doing and buying an astrolux FT03 for aroud $35 shipped, it already has a sst40 mcpcb (the board the LED sits on) so all you need is a heat source and a soldering gun and you can VERY EASILY instal a sft40. once mine comes in i will be doing it, i will try to make a couple short videos of how i do it, if you think itll help?

 

Anyway good luck and feel free to ask questions. just always remember different voltage (3volt, 6 volt, 12 volt) all need didfferent drivers. and drivers CAN BE a pain in the but to replace, and just finidng the appropriate driver can be tough too. So try to avoid the driver swapping mod in the beginning unless you are buying some convoys and just want to practice it. BUT, LED swaps are easy. and most fun LED's are 3volt (fortunately for us!)

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

Neurotoxin
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ArtieT59 wrote:
I apologize i was in a rush and didnt finish my thought. the sft40 is aa good upgrade, but it is similar to the xhp35 HI in its design and beam shape. BUTMORE Importantly – and to further TomE’s point, you cannot just drop a sbt90.2 or sft40 in that catapult. and there is no “board” replacement like you were aksing about, it requires chaging the DRIVER in that Catapult so you can run the sbt90 or sft40, or any other 3 volt emitter for that matter. The xhp35 Hi is a 12 volt only emitter, so the driver running voltage is different. so that mod is more involved becasue well you have to find an appropriate driver first (not too hard) bu tthen remove the driver and set the new one in. its more of a pain, and that catapult with xhp35 HI is a pretty nice light, i would say this. 

 


Your better off doing what im doing and buying an astrolux FT03 for aroud $35 shipped, it already has a sst40 mcpcb (the board the LED sits on) so all you need is a heat source and a soldering gun and you can VERY EASILY instal a sft40. once mine comes in i will be doing it, i will try to make a couple short videos of how i do it, if you think itll help?


 


Anyway good luck and feel free to ask questions. just always remember different voltage (3volt, 6 volt, 12 volt) all need didfferent drivers. and drivers CAN BE a pain in the but to replace, and just finidng the appropriate driver can be tough too. So try to avoid the driver swapping mod in the beginning unless you are buying some convoys and just want to practice it. BUT, LED swaps are easy. and most fun LED’s are 3volt (fortunately for us!)


Yes, my mistake, got the words mixed up, meant to say the driver but the word wouldn’t come to me so I just called everything board lol. Why is it such a pain to replace drivers but not the LED boards? I would assume it’s likely the removal process? I could imagine stubborn retainers and things like access being an issue, but other than that it should be a case of just soldering the wires off of the LED’s mcpcb, taking out the old driver, putting the new one in place and then resoldering the wires onto the pcb (3 volt, since the Catapult’s literally the only light I own that uses a 12 volt emitter, I do have a Nitecore EC4S that uses a first gen Cree XHP50, but I’m sure it’s the 3v, 5000k version). Or in the case where you’re replacing both the driver and the LED, I assume the LED already comes mounted in some mcpcb varieties u can choose from, so all you’d need to do is gut the light then drop in the new LED/pcb and solder the driver wires to the pcb then seal everything back up?

And yeah, I’d definitely appreciate a video of you doing the mod, or even just a write-up. (although after doing some writeups myself, I think a video is much easier since all you have to do is record the process and upload that, no having to upload pictures to imgur, copying links, writing down many paragraphs, organizing everything, etc) but whatever is more convenient for you!

I’ve never modified a flashlight before, never even cracked one open, in fact, but I AM handy! I’ve always been a tinkerer, I’ve taken car engines apart and repaired em, as well as taken off transmissions and reinstalled them, done other mechanical work and I was also an aircraft structural mechanic for several years in a Lufthansa MRO. All my work was on the Airbus A320 fam. (so A318’s, A319, A320’s, A321’s). They’re all basically the same, just shorter or longer and they have different door layouts (the longer one would have a door in front of the wing and another behind it vs the rest having them pretty close together) anyway that’s enough derailing, I got some new cells in today and just tried them out a few hrs ago and I’m very impressed. Could only try the 21700’s because the 18650’s didn’t work on my lights because they’re too short AND flat-tops. I think if I just solder a nice blob on the tops I should be good, though. Just need to get my soldering iron back from a friend, texted him tonight n he told me he burnt out my old one so we’ll see how quickly he gets me a replacement. Or maybe I’ll just go out and buy one tomorrow and bill him for it for being a hog hehe, I’d asked for it back several times before.

Anyway, the cells in question are Molicel P26A’s for the 18650’s. They’re INR’s rated for 2600mAh and they’re rated by Mooch for 25A. I think Sony VTC6A’s do 20A but have slightly higher capacity. I went with the Molicels cuz I wanted to try something different and they were a little over 4 bucks a pop.

The 21700’s are the Molicel P42A, 4000mAh minimum capacity and tested by Mooch at a whopping 30 amps continuous, and up to 40A at a 75* cutoff. Anyhow, I tested these in both my Lumintop D2 and my Nitecore MH10S and holy crap, after not even a minute on turbo on the Nitecore, the head got HOT as hell. Definitely not gonna wanna use these cells at full whack for extended periods of time, would likely fry most LED’s I think. Wish I had measurement equipment so I could quantify the difference and share my results here, but it’s very noticeable, specially in how hot the light gets so quickly. Maybe I’ll get the gear eventually if I’m so inclined some day. Thanks for all your feedback btw.

I just like shining my lights into the dark out of pure enjoyment and awe.
We've come far technologically and it's crazy to imagine what the future holds.

ArtieT59
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JaredM wrote:
Got it. 9.5A is ideal IMO. Wouldn't be surprised if your posted numbers are a bit overdriven w/ 4 cells. I'm going to try and resistor mod Simon's ramping driver to 9.5A and see if it in fact uses a TINY13A and customize a UI. Current plans for this emitter to live in: TN31 R-mod Supfire M6 w/ MTNe driver B158 Convoy M2 L21B (stock) Anyone with a FF E01 to try this swap ? Curious how that TIR works with this emitter. Astrolux EA01 would be interesting too.

 

Just went back through this thread to read what i missed the first time.

 

I reflowed the SFT40 in a EA01 (sst40), single emitter, TIR optic. It REALLY increased the visual throw. by a lot. I will have to measure but it is a very worthy upgrade. I still need to bust out the lux meter i bought and have never used....

 

Only weird thing (i guess)- i bought to Lishen 5000mah 21700 that are rated for 9.6 amps i think, to try and control the amps that way.. well the first time i turned on and went to turbo there was some nasty Angry Blue happening..

 

I set max ramp to 120/150 and just stopped using turbo (honestly not a big difference between 120 and turbo anyway) and no angry blue and it has been fine.

 

Now that battery voltage has dropped due to use, no angry blue happening in Turbo anymore..

 

I need to disassemble and make sure i tightened down the mcpcb screws enough and also need to test the mcpcb for flatness - something i didn't do when i originally reflowed the sft40 on the original ea01 sst40 board..

 

It made me wonder - is there any good way to control amp output on a light like the EA01 beside the battery you are using? although i do suspect i got angry blue because of a lack of heat sinking going on due to bad mcpcb contact with the shelf or not an acceptable contact due to screw tension..

 

 

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

Tom E
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You can lengthen and reduce the gauge of the LED wires. Adding resistance lowers amps.

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Yeah, and purposely using bad (steel) springs.

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Ok good to know, thank you. But nothing on the driver itself?

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

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Well, nothing that simple to the driver itself. Theoretically you could find a lower performing FET but that has other risks.

I'm cautious about downgrading springs. In lowering the amps to 8 or 9 for example, that's still a lot of amps for cheap springs and I'd be concerned about melting them, as I've seen/done before.

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Tom E wrote:

Well, nothing that simple to the driver itself. Theoretically you could find a lower performing FET but that has other risks.

I'm cautious about downgrading springs. In lowering the amps to 8 or 9 for example, that's still a lot of amps for cheap springs and I'd be concerned about melting them, as I've seen/done before.

 

thanks Tom. Also about lengthening / reducing diamter of springs- just removive the driver and solder on new springs, right? That's the best way?

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

Tom E
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Don't ask me - I'm saying I would not degrade the springs. If anything, I would add thin bypasses. I don't trust springs unless they are from Hank or are "Blue" springs.

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Tom E wrote:

Don't ask me - I'm saying I would not degrade the springs. If anything, I would add thin bypasses. I don't trust springs unless they are from Hank or are "Blue" springs.

 

sorry about that- that was a typo- I mean WIRES, not springs. 

if I want to lengthen the wires, I would remove driver and desolder existing and solder new onto it? Is that the best way?

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

thefreeman
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Tom E wrote:

Well, nothing that simple to the driver itself. Theoretically you could find a lower performing FET but that has other risks.


I’m cautious about downgrading springs. In lowering the amps to 8 or 9 for example, that’s still a lot of amps for cheap springs and I’d be concerned about melting them, as I’ve seen/done before.

Wow melting ? Shocked was it quite thin ?
I mentionned this thinking about the one in the H600 IV, 0.8mm, steel and quite long, about 50mΩ, it gets quite hot (the light draws 6A which a nearly empty cell) . I was thinking shorter and thicker steel spring would do if that exists (because 50 mΩ would be too much).

For lengthening wires, AWG22 is 0.53mΩ/cm, 24 is 0.84mΩ/cm, depending on the resistance needed it could get quite long.

I should add the SFT-40 in my DD calculator ( https://www.geogebra.org/graphing/raa8dkdm ) since it has a lower Vf than the SST-40, it helps see the effect of added resistance (but without knowing the current it’s difficult to estimate the light’s resistance)

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thefreeman wrote:
Tom E wrote:

Well, nothing that simple to the driver itself. Theoretically you could find a lower performing FET but that has other risks.

I'm cautious about downgrading springs. In lowering the amps to 8 or 9 for example, that's still a lot of amps for cheap springs and I'd be concerned about melting them, as I've seen/done before.

Wow melting ? Shocked was it quite thin ? I mentionned this thinking about the one in the H600 IV, 0.8mm, steel and quite long, about 50mΩ, it gets quite hot (the light draws 6A which a nearly empty cell) . I was thinking shorter and thicker steel spring would do if that exists (because 50 mΩ would be too much). For lengthening wires, AWG22 is 0.53mΩ/cm, 24 is 0.84mΩ/cm, depending on the resistance needed it could get quite long. I should add the SFT-40 in my DD calculator ( https://www.geogebra.org/graphing/raa8dkdm ) since it has a lower Vf than the SST-40, it helps see the effect of added resistance (but without knowing the current it’s difficult to estimate the light’s resistance)

 

thank you for this info freeman- I will say that (very unscientific) that once the battery voltage dropped from fully charged to about 4v, the angry blue went away. So of course I don't know what amps it's pushing at that point, but it just be close to being ok, meaning hopefully not a lot of resistance needs to be added to eliminate angry blue on a fully charged 9.6amp rated Lishen cell. Wow.. that was horribly uneducated way to justify my use of "not a lot of" extra wire needed LOL

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

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The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
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Tom E
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I'll reduce the wire to as much as 26 or 28 AWG, lengthened if needed. Without the ability to measure amps, it's difficult to test. I'll usually add a tail spring bypass just so that the tail amp readings I get on the clamp meter is what I expect to get with the tail re-assembled, otherwise it's guess work of how much is lost in the tail spring.

ArtieT59
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Got it that makes sense. Thank you

[FLF] Five Light Friday https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78749

Check out some of my new lights (picture heavy) and quick first impressions of them here: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/77180

My Sft40 beamshots / comparison thread: https://budgetlightforum.com/node/78100

The BLF GT with SFT40 (2300lm, 2700m+ @ 30 seconds!)
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/79561

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Another indirect way of measuring current is by measuring the voltage at the mcpcb solder points. This method has many issues to be aware of, but if care is taken to compare values at some normalized temperature, you can get an idea of roughly where your at and then can detect relative changes with mods. Useful if no other method is available.

Looking forward to throw numbers from the EA01. If they sold one with the SFT and 26800 tube and a linear driver to cap the current, it’d be a hit IMO.

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