*BLF Ultimate Lantern Project*~updates:Sofirn working on design, to produce prototype!

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DavidEF
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DBSAR wrote:
djozz wrote:
The Q-team, after half a year, just got a mail from Barry (our contact at Thorfire for the Q8) asking if they can do additional stuff for the Q8. In other words, Barry got out of hibernation and has his hands free to do new development work. Shall I ask him about doing the lantern, or do you already have contact with him or someone else at Thorfire?

I have not spoken to Barry, but would be great to talk to him on this project! send him our way. Smile


Woo-Hoo! This might be really moving soon! Party

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ToyKeeper wrote:
angerdan wrote:
Can you explain candle mode? If it’s a flickering light pretending to be a candle, it’s really annoying and shouldn’t be part of a lantern.

If candle mode annoys you, don’t use it. Other people really like it, though. Here’s a preview:

That, is cool. One of the most realistic ones I’ve seen. Only possible addition I could see would be a circle of smaller LED’s around the main one to help simulate flame deflection.

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I’m interested in one.

The possibility of an Andúril or Narsil based has got me pretty excited about this lantern.

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The candle mode in a lantern seems really awesome to me. Definitely looking forward to this!

Wølf/Diesel™

DBSAR
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WolfDiesel wrote:
The candle mode in a lantern seems really awesome to me. Definitely looking forward to this!

I like that mode idea too, give the effect of a candle or classic kerosene oil lantern for those effects that we can’t get from any other LED lantern available.

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

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There’s so many aspects of this I’m stoked about. I’ve wanted a good lantern for years now and I feel like this is it, finally going to have a great lantern. The candle mode is honestly just a big bonus to me.

Wølf/Diesel™

DBSAR
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WolfDiesel wrote:
There’s so many aspects of this I’m stoked about. I’ve wanted a good lantern for years now and I feel like this is it, finally going to have a great lantern. The candle mode is honestly just a big bonus to me.

I should receive the Thorfire provided Q8 tomorrow in the mail, and plan to work on that for the new prototype base this weekend to get this project rolling.

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

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UPDATES,April,20,2018 -:The Q8 sample/mule arrived for the updated prototype. I have already torn down the head, and have the driver out, and doing measurements of where to cut the head down to incorporate the new lantern shade/lens and center support post. First thing is i need some guidance on what to do with the Q8 driver to reduce its maximum output in all the high modes down to 1.5 amps possibly? I could leave it as s, but with the high output current in the lantern running continuous it would overheat the LEDs & lantern head very, very quickly and likely cook the LEDs or melt the lens attached to the solid aluminum head. I plan on the new prototype to run two down-firing LEDs on each side of the center support post/bolt instead of the single LED as in the 1st gen prototype. Also will use a frosted main shade/lens with no inner diffuser instead of the clear lens & inner diffuser as the 1st prototype does to reduce manufacturing costs. The lantern head I have already blue-printed and in thw works on the Q8 head design, right now i need to driver experienced team members ToyKeeper, DEL, and even possibly the original Q8 team to help directing me to modding the driver to reduce its peak current to the LEDs. As of now I will keep the current Narsil program in place for the first prototype lantern, using the #7 mode set. But we will look to Toykeeper to possibly add the extra good modes including the candle & sunset modes to the firmware later. More updates soon as i work on the structure of the Q8 head for the lantern Smile

SECOND UPDATE:-After looking over & measuring the original Q8 copper 4-emitter star, I may build the V2 prototype lantern using that very same start & its emitters, as it already has a center hole, & can be actuall fitted to the same heat-sink head of the V1 prototype of the lantern, (further reducing costs? but unsure if it will be cheaper for the production model to use that Q8 PCB, or use two separate more generic 16mm copper single-LED stars.

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

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DBSAR wrote:
I plan on the new prototype to run two down-firing LEDs on each side of the center support post/bolt instead of the single LED as in the 1st gen prototype.

So, 4 LEDs total? Could you just re-use the stock Q8 PCB but upside down? You could use the center hole in the PCB for the mounting post, and run the wires parallel or through that same post?

Find all my reviews of flashlights and more gear at www.bmengineer.com

DBSAR
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bmengineer wrote:
DBSAR wrote:
I plan on the new prototype to run two down-firing LEDs on each side of the center support post/bolt instead of the single LED as in the 1st gen prototype.

So, 4 LEDs total? Could you just re-use the stock Q8 PCB but upside down? You could use the center hole in the PCB for the mounting post, and run the wires parallel or through that same post?

I just updated the above post as you probably replied on that possibility. Big Smile

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

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bmengineer wrote:
If the board is being redesigned is there any change of using a single usb-c port in lieu of separate usb in and out? Would that end up being higher or lower in cost?

There are already lights that use a USB “OTG” adapter to do charge/powerbank from a single port. Granted you need this dongle but it’s still 1 port.

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This is awesome! I’m so glad to see the project getting some updates and action. Thank you all for your work, especially DBSAR, I really want this one to happen!

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DBSAR wrote:
djozz wrote:
The Q-team, after half a year, just got a mail from Barry (our contact at Thorfire for the Q8) asking if they can do additional stuff for the Q8. In other words, Barry got out of hibernation and has his hands free to do new development work. Shall I ask him about doing the lantern, or do you already have contact with him or someone else at Thorfire?

I have not spoken to Barry, but would be great to talk to him on this project! send him our way. Smile

While arranging the Q8 for you, I asked Miranda to make sure Barry saw this thread. She said she would, and sounded enthusiastic about the project.

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DBSAR wrote:
right now i need to driver experienced team members ToyKeeper, DEL, and even possibly the original Q8 team to help directing me to modding the driver to reduce its peak current to the LEDs. As of now I will keep the current Narsil program in place for the first prototype lantern, using the #7 mode set. But we will look to Toykeeper to possibly add the extra good modes including the candle & sunset modes to the firmware later.

I’d suggest replacing the FET with a stack of 7135s, maybe start at four. Easiest way is to piggyback a generic 7135 driver onto the board, lifting the control pin from the piggyback board MCU and connecting it instead to the gate drive of the Q8 FET. I thought DEL had designed this already, he’s the one to look too for advice.

DBSAR wrote:

SECOND UPDATE:-After looking over & measuring the original Q8 copper 4-emitter star, I may build the V2 prototype lantern using that very same start & its emitters, as it already has a center hole, & can be actuall fitted to the same heat-sink head of the V1 prototype of the lantern, (further reducing costs? but unsure if it will be cheaper for the production model to use that Q8 PCB, or use two separate more generic 16mm copper single-LED stars.

That sounds like a plan. The Q8 MCPCB shouldn’t cost much, actually it should be rather inexpensive if Thorfire are to be the manufacturer. A new MCPCB supplier was brought on by the Q8 team, who I think have performed (not sure if they used the recommended supplier or did it otherwise, but these big technical parts are not expensive in volume) , possibly speak to djozz who I think set this part up.

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Interested in one!

DBSAR
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RobertB wrote:
DBSAR wrote:
djozz wrote:
The Q-team, after half a year, just got a mail from Barry (our contact at Thorfire for the Q8) asking if they can do additional stuff for the Q8. In other words, Barry got out of hibernation and has his hands free to do new development work. Shall I ask him about doing the lantern, or do you already have contact with him or someone else at Thorfire?

I have not spoken to Barry, but would be great to talk to him on this project! send him our way. Smile

While arranging the Q8 for you, I asked Miranda to make sure Barry saw this thread. She said she would, and sounded enthusiastic about the project.

Looking forward to hearing from Barry on this Smile

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

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Tom Tom wrote:
I’d suggest replacing the FET with a stack of 7135s, maybe start at four. Easiest way is to piggyback a generic 7135 driver onto the board, lifting the control pin from the piggyback board MCU and connecting it instead to the gate drive of the Q8 FET. I thought DEL had designed this already, he’s the one to look too for advice.

That’s what i’m planning on trying in this case.

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

angerdan
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DBSAR wrote:
I plan on the new prototype to run two down-firing LEDs on each side of the center support post/bolt instead of the single LED as in the 1st gen prototype. Also will use a frosted main shade/lens with no inner diffuser instead of the clear lens & inner diffuser as the 1st prototype does to reduce manufacturing costs.

Using a construction like the Fenix CL20R with horizontal mounted LEDs would make the lens unneccessary.
Is it a good idea to use only two LEDs?
And what about additional red LED?
Simple to use would it be if you can choose the programming at order, to set only the needed modes and levels as well as the mode order and memory function. Since optional bluetooth modules for later upgrades seem to be not in the concept.

contactcr wrote:
bmengineer wrote:
If the board is being redesigned is there any change of using a single usb-c port in lieu of separate usb in and out? Would that end up being higher or lower in cost?

There are already lights that use a USB “OTG” adapter to do charge/powerbank from a single port. Granted you need this dongle but it’s still 1 port.

And there are Powerbanks which offers two Ports – one USB-C (dual) and one USB A-Type (output). So with USB-C everything is possible.
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Thanks to DBSAR and everyone else helping the project progress!

Can I get put on the list for another 2 lanterns (total of 3).

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angerdan wrote:
Is it a good idea to use only two LEDs? And what about additional red LED? Simple to use would it be if you can choose the programming at order, to set only the needed modes and levels as well as the mode order and memory function.

Two LEDs are plenty for the lantern’s target brightness level. Really, even one LED is enough. It only needs to make 500 lm.

A red LED is unlikely because there probably won’t be an extra pin available to control it. This could change though, depending on details.

The current firmware lets the user set the brightness of the lowest and highest levels, and the total number of levels. They are evenly-spaced on a visually-linear scale, automatically. From off, the user has direct access to the lowest level, the highest level, and the memorized level. And quick access to a variety of other modes too, by clicking three or more times.

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interested in one, thanks

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Yes, one led is enough, that one is probably easier to spread out evenly if any optic would be used. The led even does not need to be on a DTP board, any crap alu board will do the job. Further, the lantern need not to be built very heavy, perhaps for rigidity but not for heat spreading.

I sent a mail to Barry with some suggestions for the Q8, but also I directed him to this thread and suggested to contact DBSAR via PM. I have the impression that email is easier for him so perhaps you could send him an email too? (I will get you his by PM ).

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I’d definitely love to see USB C integration. The more I read about updates and discussion about this the more exciting it gets.

Wølf/Diesel™

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Having had a couple of USB C devices it I should say it is nothing special as a power connector, possibly weaker than even USB micro. Good old USB mini is far better. Designed for slimline mobile ‘phones, and people who struggle to put the connector in the right way around, to be chucked away or “upgraded” every couple of years.

It does support rapid charging using various proprietary protocols and chargers, which work, but I don’t think are needed here.

It serves a function as a modern data connector I suppose, but doesn’t replace a big solid standard

edit: USB A (maybe 3) port in my affections. Plenty of room for one of these on this lantern. Which, by the way, is also good as a 2+ Amp output connection for powerbank applications.

edit off:

Rant off.

I think this lantern has no need for anything more than a single LED and a generic 7135 driver, perhaps modded for e-switch, preferably with a flashable Attiny controller, maybe running Crescendo. (I think it fits on even the Attiny 13).

I have not signed the interest list because I don’t think I need this, or want the weight/robustness. I already have two Cybalite/Ring/Frendo lanterns which have given good use over several years running from x3 D cells (or Cs or AAs in carriers). Notionally 300 lumens, which is plenty.

This sort of thing: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ring-Cyba-Lite-Vega-LED-Lantern/dp/B002FW3TF4

I even gave one an emitter swap to warm it up. They are good enough for me, despite being made of (lightweight, very durable and strong) plastic.

I can also remove the reflector/diffuser and use them as a naked light bulb. Which is how they are mostly used, hanging from a tree on a bit of string, or bouncing off the roof of the tent.

I did consider hollowing out the battery box and putting in as many 18650s in parallel as would fit, together with a charging circuit, but never got around to it.

I will buy into this at the right price, I do love chunky metal things, well designed, and this looks like one.

DBSAR
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WolfDiesel wrote:
I’d definitely love to see USB C integration. The more I read about updates and discussion about this the more exciting it gets.

Higher cost may a prohibiting factor to use a USB-C plug interface/port which is designed more for phones & tablets with data transfer + charging. As in the lantern its just a charging port (no data) its not really worth the point of using a more expensive USB-C interface for just a charging port. The only advantage it would have in this case would be the ambidextrous plug, (can plug in to the port in ant direction) I can not find any power charging circuit that has the USB-C yet.

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

sovereignknight
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Interested depending on cost! Would love to have an option for 5000k.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_3:16 

Flashlights:

x6 Sk68 modded 3 Nichia 319AT, 3 Cree XP-G3 - x1 Solorforce P60 drop in custom XM-L2 U4 1C, Qlight Rev.A 7135*8 3.04A Driver - x2 Lumintop EDC05 CW - x2 Jaxman E2L tripple XP-G2 S4 
x1 Jaxman Z1 Zoomie, w/ Cree MT-G2 Q0 LED - x1 Acebeam K40m thrower with MT-G2 Q0 LED - x1 Xintd SC-82 V5 Limited Edition C8, XM-L2 U4 1C, Qlight Rev.A 7135*8 3.04A Driver
x1 Convoy L6 moded with a Cree XHP-70.2 P2 1D LED - x1 Rare Olight x7 Maurauder with a Nuetral White LED - x1 Astrolux MF-01 Nichia 219c - x1 Astrolux MF-01 Cree XP-G3 - x2 Zebralight SC5w MKII  

x6 Lumintop Tool AA - x1  x2 Lumintop Tool AA 2.0 - x1 Lumintop ODL20C - x1 Lumintop GT mini - Olight i3E EOS - x2 Zebralight SC600w Plus MK IV XHP 50.2 4500k 80 CRI - x1 Fenix CL30R - x1 Lumintop C01 Bike Light - x1 Lumintop Zoom 1 - x2 Zebralight Sc700d

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I just found out I haven’t yet showed my interest on this project, how come?

I’d be in for one. If it shares the tube/interface with the Q8 it might get me to buy the set

I see talk about brightness in the 500 lumen range, but with a configurable ceiling I think having the option to go all out would be cool too

In my Tree

My collectionEmisar: D4 / D1 / D4 (broken) ― Convoy: C8 Clear / S2+ Clear / S2+ / S2+ UV / S6 ― Nitecore: Tube / Thumb / Concept 1 / HC30 / HC33 / TIP / TIP CRI / TINI ― Lumintop: Tool AAA / Tool AA / HLAAA / EDC05 ― Sofirn: SF10 / SF12 / SF12 / SF14 / SF14 / SF14 / SP10A / SP10A (gifted) ― Jaxman: E3 ― UTorch: UT01 ― Trustfire: Z2 ― Skyfire: SF-065 (trashed)

Barry0892
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I would love to help fulfill the project. Please check your message.

Barry

Not Enough Great Lights

Not in ThorFire Team since June

DBSAR
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Barry0892 wrote:
I would love to help fulfill the project. Please check your message.

Barry

Reading the message now Smile

That Canadian flashlight guy & Lantern Guru -Den / DBSARlight

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Tom Tom wrote:
Good old USB mini is far better. Designed for slimline mobile ‘phones, and people who struggle to put the connector in the right way around, to be chucked away or “upgraded” every couple of years.

I liked miniUSB too. Unfortunately it has been abandoned around 2010.

DBSAR wrote:
Higher cost may a prohibiting factor to use a USB-C plug interface/port which is designed more for phones & tablets with data transfer + charging. As in the lantern its just a charging port (no data) its not really worth the point of using a more expensive USB-C interface for just a charging port. The only advantage it would have in this case would be the ambidextrous plug, (can plug in to the port in ant direction) I can not find any power charging circuit that has the USB-C yet.

Can’t the USB-C plug be used exactly like an microUSB plug, with the only difference it’s a few cent more expensive to buy?
Advantage would be lontime cable compatibility without the need for adapters. And of course when using in dark/unlit places, plugging in the cable will be more convenient Smile

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