Talk about future projects and donation topic

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lionheart_2281
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The Miller wrote:
That could be a good idea, but would a bigger lens, maybe a second for more light ot not be interesting? you know cramp some innovations in there? maybe have the small lens close to the LED do the moving so the head holding the big lens can be part of the cooling system. a hard driven XHP35hi in there…. just thinking out loud here.

Let those ideas keep percolating mate, I’m sure you’ll come up with something special by the time the GT goes into production.

stephenk
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I like the sound of the Q4 and zoomie.

I’d love to see an 18650 RGBW colour mixing light. Similar functionality to protomachines, but at 20% of the cost.

The Miller
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thanks!

stephenk, you mean a light with three colored LEDs and a way to control each one to get the preferred colors?
That would be MELD software right?
Funny story, when Thorfire send me the S70 and S50 just bought the Uniquefire 1401. I asked Throfire to make a light like that (4 individual small reflectors with a LED, using 3 primary colors and a NW LED in the 4th space.
For the reason of people being able to blend colors to their liking. They did not understand what I was talking about, heheh had a hard time grasping the notion of a soda can light, lol we showed them what a soda can light it didn’t we Wink

stephenk
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The Miller wrote:
thanks!

stephenk, you mean a light with three colored LEDs and a way to control each one to get the preferred colors?
That would be MELD software right?
Funny story, when Thorfire send me the S70 and S50 just bought the Uniquefire 1401. I asked Throfire to make a light like that (4 individual small reflectors with a LED, using 3 primary colors and a NW LED in the 4th space.
For the reason of people being able to blend colors to their liking. They did not understand what I was talking about, heheh had a hard time grasping the notion of a soda can light, lol we showed them what a soda can light it didn’t we Wink

Yes, something based on MELD software with RGBW emitters and the ability to colour mix, but “off the shelf”, would be very popular with light painters. Not sure how popular it would be with the average flashaholic though.

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The cometa is ok but frankly the intensity is about the same or actually a bit worse then the $13 X60 I got from banggood (I sold it so can’t do a direct comparison). The X60 has a bit larger lens so like everything when it comes to throw, size is king.

A larger lens would be a good idea, the cometa just doesn’t impress all that much.

A second reflector lens adds a lot of complication and is only to be done by a properly capable manufacture. If that is possible a second lens does increase the hot spot size, which is nice but doesn’t really effect throw.

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It would be nice to see loneoceans boost driver go into production and one way would be to incorporate it into a BLF SE project as was done with the A6 driver done by wight(aka Alex Wells). It probably needs to undergo some field testing first but it’s a significant upgrade from any other boost driver currently on the market. Supporting that and similar projects is something I could get behind.

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Legit enthusiast-approved right angle headlamp.

CRX
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Rufusbduck wrote:
It would be nice to see loneoceans boost driver go into production and one way would be to incorporate it into a BLF SE project as was done with the A6 driver done by wight(aka Alex Wells). It probably needs to undergo some field testing first but it’s a significant upgrade from any other boost driver currently on the market. Supporting that and similar projects is something I could get behind.

+1

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Yes good point RBD!
I will contact him

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As this is now declared a discussion thread, I have an opinion on the Q4:

It is tempting to want the Q4 to be compatible with alkalines and Eneloops and I am not for it for two reasons:

1) there are quite a few pretty nice flashlights out there already that run on 4xAA cells. Even if the Q4 will be a quad, that does not add an awful lot to what is out there, a bit more output and less throw. The Q4 will not stand out other than that it may have a BLF developed nice user interface.

2) in case of dual compatibility I do not see how 14500 li-ions can be run to the max when the light also is able to run on alkalines/NiMh’s (but I’d love to be wrong, I’m not an expert on drivers). The full advantage of high current 14500 li-ion cells can only be had with a dedicated li-ion driver.

So my proposal is very simple: shrink the Q8!!
(Honey, I shrunk the Q8!)
It is almost as simple as asking Thorfire to ask just that: do everything the same as the Q8, just smaller (detail: I think that many fine fins like the LuckySun D80 has will help). But I would like to try to achieve 2 extra things: 1)see where the shrunken Q8 can be made even a bit smaller, to get the Q4 smaller than any 4xAA-size light out there (to start,a quad reflector is already shorter than a reflector for a single led), 2)add onboard charging via a micro-USB port.

On max, the output will be 4 times the output of the BLF-X5, so 4800 lumen on fresh IMR’s. Unrivalled by anything this size! Of course it can only be run on max for very short bursts of 30 seconds, probably limited by a simple timer, but that is where al those lower modes come in.

link to djozz tests 

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CRX wrote:
Rufusbduck wrote:
It would be nice to see loneoceans boost driver go into production and one way would be to incorporate it into a BLF SE project as was done with the A6 driver done by wight(aka Alex Wells). It probably needs to undergo some field testing first but it’s a significant upgrade from any other boost driver currently on the market. Supporting that and similar projects is something I could get behind.

+1

+100

Would like to see 17mm driver version sold separately also
mattlward
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I would love to see a Q4 14500 only happen! I would second that it would be nice to see a good boost driver with a good interface in 17mm!

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Well, if you had a buck driver with a wide input voltage range, it could use either AA Alkaline/NimH or 14500 Li-Ion cells in series. 4X Eneloops could put out a respectable amount of light if the driver was designed well, and 4X 14500’s could really fire up the imagination!

Having said that, I’d prefer the Q4 to be designed as a mini-Q8, with 4X 14500 in parallel feeding to 4X XP-L HI or something like that, using a multi-channel FET/7135 driver.

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The Manker MK41 looks like it does pretty well with both AA and 14500.

http://www.mankerlight.com/manker-mk41-compact-thrower-4x-aa-14500-flash...

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Hmm yeah parallel cells for the Q4
That is the challenge IMHO
So there will be a BLF driver that can run on AA or 14500
For else there would not be something new coming from it, just a scaled down Q8 is nice and all but rather boring for all would be clear before the actual start Wink
It is rewarding for me to see new things and just a BLF remake of something doesn’t feel new

don’t get me wrong I love my BLF special lights that are remakes but it doesn’t feel worth my time to just mix existing stuff
For example I kind of dropped the idea of a Q10/16 when I only thought it would be a scaled up 26650 Q8, when a quad XHP35HI quad 2S2P 26650 light popped up yeah then it made sense to go for a Q16 for this means a challenge.

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As for 4 14500 only for the Q4, TA wrote in the GT topic that making a light for a 32650/26650/20700/18650 just makes more sense in this case and with that I agree hencey stubborn AA wish Big Smile for of those a lot of cool things are already in existence

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The Miller wrote:
As for 4 14500 only for the Q4, TA wrote in the GT topic that making a light for a 32650/26650/20700/18650 just makes more sense in this case and with that I agree hencey stubborn AA wish Big Smile for of those a lot of cool things are already in existence

AA could still easily be used in a light designed around the larger lithium cells and you would get better performance in every way.

Just quoting some posts from the GT thread on this subject:

Texas_Ace wrote:
I will never understand why people want to have a light that requires special / expensive 14500 batteries, will get half the runtime and way less output of a single larger cell?

A single 32650 is the same basic size as 4× 14500 but offers WAY more power and runtime. Not to mention it is a lot cheaper and you can use a 26650 or 18650 if you desire as well. Even an 18650 offers more power, current and runtime then 4× 14500’s.

4 of the best 14500’s would be roughly a 2400ma ~15-18A cell
An 18650 offers you 3000ma in a 25-30A cell
A 20700 offers you 4000ma and 15-20A+
26650 offers 5000ma and 20-30A
finally the old 32650 offers 6000ma and 20A++ (forgot what it’s rating was)

Just me I guess. Sad

Texas_Ace wrote:
The nice thing about building a light for a 32650 is that it can work with any cell you can think of, with a spacer you can use a 26650, 20700, 18650.

They also make 3x AA carriers already that could drop in for those that wanted to do that. They are dirt cheap as well.

Could even use adapters and use AAA in those carriers.

In fact if you made it a little larger you could fit 3× 18650’s in there.

Building it for a 32650 with a cell carrier for 14500’s if someone wanted to use those for some reason makes way more sense. I would totally buy that.

A 14500 only light, why would I want it?

Texas_Ace wrote:
The point is that the 32650 is about the same size as 4× 14500 and provides 2.5x the power in the same space for less money too boot. On top of that the 14500 and AA can still be used with a light setup around the 32650 where the reverse is not possible. Plus on top of that you can use a 26650 or any other size cell you want making it one of the most versital lights around.

The fact is that 14500’s suck monkey balls. I have a few 14500 lights and they are interesting toys but that is all they will ever be. The runtime is downright horrible. They simply do not have enough power to do anything else. Even an 18350 has more power then a 14500. I am lucky to get a few minutes of runtime before they start to noticeably dim.

The only thing worse then a 14500 is a 10440 but at least it has a significant size reduction to justify the dismal performance.

Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.

The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. --Herbert Spencer , English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT - XHP70.2 P2 - XHP50.2 J4 - Samsung LH351D

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The Miller
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yeah and here it is OT, nice
Again, xx650 is too long, AA and 14500 are significantly shorter.
A extruded tube and tail like the TK4A are shorter and no need for a carrier.
Q4 is a AA driven light primarily not a 32650 light where AA can be added, because then this comes into play:

The Miller wrote:
Hmm yeah parallel cells for the Q4
That is the challenge IMHO
So there will be a BLF driver that can run on AA or 14500
For else there would not be something new coming from it, just a scaled down Q8 is nice and all but rather boring for all would be clear before the actual start Wink
It is rewarding for me to see new things and just a BLF remake of something doesn’t feel new

don’t get me wrong I love my BLF special lights that are remakes but it doesn’t feel worth my time to just mix existing stuff
For example I kind of dropped the idea of a Q10/16 when I only thought it would be a scaled up 26650 Q8, when a quad XHP35HI quad 2S2P 26650 light popped up yeah then it made sense to go for a Q16 for this means a challenge.

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The Miller wrote:
yeah and here it is OT, nice Again, xx650 is too long, AA and 14500 are significantly shorter. A extruded tube and tail like the TK4A are shorter and no need for a carrier. Q4 is a AA driven light primarily not a 32650 light where AA can be added, because then this comes into play:

As I pointed out in the other thread, the total length of the light would be the same regardless of which cells you used. The TK4A is 115mm long, about the shortest it can be and still be ergonomic.

A 65mm long cell can have the same total length as seen on the NE01. So the size “issue” is a moot point. Ergonomics will determain the minimum length anyways. With an e-switch light if it is too short you will not be able to access the switch without repositioning the light every time.

As far as the quote. So what you are saying is that you don’t care what the light is as long as a new driver is designed for it? A driver that would be useless in any other light as it would be too large for any normal lights and too small for any SRK style lights?

Not to mention that such a driver could cost as much as the entire light and thus almost double the cost of the light.

If it is primarily an AA light, then why make it? The TK4A is good enough and we can’t improve on it except for a better UI since the AA’s themselves will be the limiting factor on brightness. Way easier to just build a new driver for that light for people to swap in.

If this is something you have your heart set on, then fine. Doing something because you can is as good a reason as any.

Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.

The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. --Herbert Spencer , English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT - XHP70.2 P2 - XHP50.2 J4 - Samsung LH351D

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I’m not trying to join this argument, but I’d like to make just one point. There are plenty of tiny lights on the market with side e-switch. If it were bad for ergonomics, they wouldn’t sell, and the manufacturers would stop making them.

Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone.
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DavidEF wrote:
I’m not trying to join this argument, but I’d like to make just one point. There are plenty of tiny lights on the market with side e-switch. If it were bad for ergonomics, they wouldn’t sell, and the manufacturers would stop making them.

I never said the side switch was bad, I said that if you make the light too short it will be impossible to comfortably hold the light in such a way to allow easy access to the switch without having to reposition the light every time.

Which is why you don’t really see side switch lights shorter then ~110-120mm.

If the TK4A didn’t exist I would not be so opposed to the idea but as it is, rebuilding the TK4A with a different driver seems like a waste when you will get nothing out of it except the ability to use expensive, crummy, low powered, “fragile” 14500’s that have less power then a 18350.

Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.

The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. --Herbert Spencer , English Philosopher (1820-1903)

Texas Avenger Driver Series

My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT - XHP70.2 P2 - XHP50.2 J4 - Samsung LH351D

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DavidEF
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Texas_Ace wrote:
Which is why you don’t really see side switch lights shorter then ~110-120mm.

This, specifically, is what I was disagreeing with. There are actually plenty of lights with side switch that are shorter than this.

Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone.
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DavidEF wrote:
Texas_Ace wrote:
Which is why you don’t really see side switch lights shorter then ~110-120mm.
This, specifically, is what I was disagreeing with. There are actually plenty of lights with side switch that are shorter than this.

There are side switch lights shorter then 110mm that are 30mm+ wide? Never seen that, but then I don’t pay a lot of attention to lights outside the budget arena.

To be honest I have only seen a handful of lights less then 100mm with a side switch. All of these were tiny pocket lights that were meant to be held with your fingertips. This light will not be a fingertip light due to the 30mm+ width and weight to go with it.

That aside though, the rest of the points I made are still completely valid. 14500’s are the worst cells in existence besides 10440’s. Why would I use those when there are other options that are the same size or smaller but offer far better performance for far less money?

An 18650 offers more power and current then 4× 14500’s. 18350’s offer more power then 14500’s. From a practical standpoint, why would anyone use 14500’s in a light like this? I know I would gladly trade 1.5cm of extra length for a battery that gives me over 2x the runtime and costs less then 1/2 the price.

Plus I have Man sized hands, I need that extra length anyways.

Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.

The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. --Herbert Spencer , English Philosopher (1820-1903)

Texas Avenger Driver Series

My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT - XHP70.2 P2 - XHP50.2 J4 - Samsung LH351D

Easy comparison tool for all my LED tests

The Miller
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Hmm you read:

Quote:

. So what you are saying is that you don’t care if the light is for all intents useless as long as a new driver is designed for it? A driver that would be useless in any other light as it would be too large for any normal lights and too small for any SRK style lights?


? Really?

Don’t really know how to respond to this…

Maybe, if you don’t care about AA lights fine, don’t get involved, don’t ask to be on the list and don’t buy it, I am not forcing you Wink

Maybe, if you don’t get my drive for these projects that take a lot of time and energy that is fine, but please refrain from commenting especially using words like useless if you don’t see value for yourself, be polite man!

Maybe, PD68 made a triple down driver, Tom and DEL made a big Q8 driver and you then made the TA series allowing people to use Narsil or Bistro in various lights, a relatively big AA/14500 driver design might just lead to drivers people can use in all the lights for a single AA.

Maybe, well I try to get things done, with a positive attitude and can do “if there is a will, a way can be found” mentality. Nay saying, seeing things negative is not my style, example? A certain BLFer was sure the GT driver would cost manufacturer at least $25 and just asking a few questions to the right persons now has lead to almost ordering the parts for a first proto, and guess what, if we divide the oshpark bill by 3 (minimum for these size boards) and buying parts one piece instead of large quantities it already is lower then $25 for us, so half of that for larger quantities. Meaning $10 at most for manufacturer, making me very glad I did not listen to that BLFer Wink

Maybe,
Why can’t you just steer clear if all you want to say you don’t see something of use for you, you don’t see it work, you want it to be something else, you think it is too expensive and what not.
Just start your 32650 light to use the Ultrafire 32650 cell linked to in the GT topic, with a nice AA holder, make that awesome versatile light, you can add me on the interest list. I just don’t see a personal interest in being part of a team making it, have said this before so it must get through to you what the idea of the Q4 is.
Find an angle for why a 32650 light would push BLF forward, discuss a light like that as a light NOT the Q4 and who knows it might be something to pursue after all. Or if the wish for 32650 is strong it could be the size for the zoomie for example adding versatility to that light.
Just unhook it from the Q4. The only thing that is hard is dealing with nastiness and nay sayers, all the rest is a joy and party.
It is a hobby dude Wink

Yeah that last maybe is probably the best answer Wink

DavidEF
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Texas_Ace wrote:
DavidEF wrote:
Texas_Ace wrote:
Which is why you don’t really see side switch lights shorter then ~110-120mm.
This, specifically, is what I was disagreeing with. There are actually plenty of lights with side switch that are shorter than this.

There are side switch lights shorter then 110mm that are 30mm+ wide? Never seen that, but then I don’t pay a lot of attention to lights outside the budget arena.

To be honest I have only seen a handful of lights less then 100mm with a side switch. All of these were tiny pocket lights that were meant to be held with your fingertips. This light will not be a fingertip light due to the 30mm+ width and weight to go with it.

That aside though, the rest of the points I made are still completely valid. 14500’s are the worst cells in existence besides 10440’s. Why would I use those when there are other options that are the same size or smaller but offer far better performance for far less money?

An 18650 offers more power and current then 4× 14500’s. 18350’s offer more power then 14500’s. From a practical standpoint, why would anyone use 14500’s in a light like this? I know I would gladly trade 1.5cm of extra length for a battery that gives me over 2x the runtime and costs less then 1/2 the price.

Plus I have Man sized hands, I need that extra length anyways.


DQG Tiny 26650 (hey look, even with a big/long cell!) has dimensions of 97mm long x 36mm diameter. It has a side switch. Like The Miller said, if you have a preference, there’s nothing wrong with stating that preference. But in this case, you’re coming across as pushy, arrogant, and rude. We can’t read your mind, but your words seem to indicate that you think your opinion is ‘truth’ or at least that it is a universal opinion. (Blame the internet!) Your Man-sized hands are a legitimate concern for you but not necessarily for others. Wink

Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone.
-Ayn Rand

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I may have come off a bit harsh, I am sorry for that. I like what you are doing and support your work, which is why I pushed the GT project and want to see all of these projects succeed.

This is also why I don’t want to see a year+ of time spent on a light that makes no logical sense when that time and effort could be spent on a better and more usable light. I want to see more lights come into production that can truly push things forward such as the Q8 and GT.

For the record, I said that the TA buck costs $25 to make and it was the closest thing we had to what the GT needed. I knew the cost could be reduced due to only needing about 1/4 the current the TA buck was designed for but every time I talked to DEL about it he said he didn’t want to get involved with a buck driver.

Thus the only option for such a driver was the TA buck, which DOES cost $25 (more if you only build 1).

I also edited my post after rereading it but after you had started typing your apparently. My post was a bit harsh.

I am a logical guy, I will always look to the most logical option to a goal. Using 14500’s is not logical when other options are considered. There are tons of negatives but only 1 possible positive, it could be 15mm shorter, in a light that is too large and heavy to be a fingertip light and then falls into that awkward middle ground between handheld and fingertip / pocket light.

Larger cells on the other hand offer tons of benefits and make much more logical sense. I simply wanted to point out the logical side of such a light so that people could know what they are getting into.

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The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. --Herbert Spencer , English Philosopher (1820-1903)

Texas Avenger Driver Series

My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT - XHP70.2 P2 - XHP50.2 J4 - Samsung LH351D

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djozz
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I agree with David that lack of comfort holding it is not enough reason to not want the Q4 as short as possible. Many lights are very short and I like them for their compactness and I still find them comfortable to hold. The SWM D40A and the Crelant V4A are 12cm, the shorter Manker MK41 is 10.5cm, but because of the short quad reflector and if we do not use a battery carrier, we can make the Q4 as short as 8cm. Mind that that is a full cm shorter than the newest DQG tiny 26650! When also squaring off the middle section of the battery tube, we have an ultra-compact 4xAA light that makes the most of the advantage that AA-size is shorter than 18650-size.

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DavidEF wrote:
DQG Tiny 26650 (hey look, even with a big/long cell!) has dimensions of 97mm long x 36mm diameter. It has a side switch. Like The Miller said, if you have a preference, there’s nothing wrong with stating that preference. But in this case, you’re coming across as pushy, arrogant, and rude. We can’t read your mind, but your words seem to indicate that you think your opinion is ‘truth’ or at least that it is a universal opinion. (Blame the internet!) Your Man-sized hands are a legitimate concern for you but not necessarily for others. Wink

I said “really” see. Sure there are always fringe cases. Wink

I agree, my wording was a bit strong. Although all of the facts about the batteries, are just that, facts. Not opinion.

The only opinion is that the shortest it should be is ~110m. That is indeed my opinion, although that is an opinion that would be backed up by most market research consultants as seen by the fact there are very few lights shorter then that.

I will bow out now, I only wanted to bring attention to the logical side of using larger cells over 14500’s. I have done that and there is no need to continue doing it. People can make up their own mind.

My opinion is that the time, effort and resources would be better spent on something besides this. This is one of those things you make when you run out of things to make IMHO.

Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.

The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. --Herbert Spencer , English Philosopher (1820-1903)

Texas Avenger Driver Series

My LED Test series - XP-L2 V5  - Nichia 219C 90+ CRILatticebright "XM-L"XHP35 & PWM efficiency - XHP50 - XP-L V5 - XM-L2 U2 - XP-G3 S5  - XP-L HI V2 - Oslon Square & direct comparison to Djozz tests - Nichia 319A - Nichia 219B 9080 CRI - Nichia 219C D320 - Nichia 229AT - XHP70.2 P2 - XHP50.2 J4 - Samsung LH351D

Easy comparison tool for all my LED tests

The Miller
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The 4P AA 14500 Q4 is a really nice follow up with Thorfire IMHO
They do the Q8
We take the TK4A tube, tail and switch, scale down the head of the Q8, design driver and build on the trust there is now.
AA lights are very useful, in the car for example here I measured -12°C to 60°C, no way I want a li ion cell in that.
The 14500 is just added bonus for Mac brightness and so we can develop a driver that paves the way for some sweet Bistro / Narsil SK68 or whatever AA or 14500 light
Complex firmware on a AA would be my prime goal for the Q4 so to say.
That is why our normal 2,7-4,2V input are less interesting here, making it work on 0,9-1,6 AND 2,7-4,2V that is the challenge and a mighty big one I’d say.

djozz
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4xAA is 4.8V nominal, versus 3.7V for li-ion. You can not burn that off with a lineair/direct driver. It will need a buck driver, and it needs to deliver at least 6A to the emitters if you want an output that is remotely impressive with a floody quad set-up (2400 lumen). Quite a challenge that is!

The TK4A looks like a good start but I don’t like the ears at the bottom, it adds unneccessary length, in my opinion of course.

link to djozz tests 

“I used to think that top environmental problems were biodiversity loss, ecosystem collapse and climate change. I thought that thirty years of good science could address these problems. I was wrong. The top environmental problems are selfishness, greed and apathy, and to deal with these we need a cultural and spiritual transformation. And we scientists don’t know how to do that.”   (Gus Speth)

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