Q8, PMS SEND TO THOSE WITH ISSUES BLF soda can light

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hank
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So why would the brightness be asymmetrical?

tekwyzrd
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hank wrote:
So why would the brightness be asymmetrical?

Variation between production runs? Maybe lights exhibiting this got leds from two different spools as the board made its way down the assembly line. Still waiting for mine – expected delivery friday according to the tracking number.

edit: this situation is why I’m surprised how codes were issued. As I said previously, as an early ‘I’m in’ I was ready and willing to accept the possibility of flaws and take steps to help resolve them before a mass production run as I imagine others were. I’m not criticizing The Miller for his distribution of codes but in future special production runs an early test production run to buyers with the ability and willingness to help resolve problems avoiding putting items in the hands of individuals who just want it to work right would avoid bad feelings and negative press. The individuals involved in the development were alpha testers. Recipients of the first production run are beta testers. I’ve done both with software so it’s not a big deal to me.

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Speaking as someone who doesn’t have theirs yet..

Come on man.. Production has been halted less than 24 hours. I know everyone wants their light but Thorfire doesn’t want to send out lights with issues. Their name is also on the line here. They have something like 1500 units ready to be assembled that are now just sitting doing nothing. They want this fixed more than any of us. This hurts their bottom line.

Your ship date on banggood likely says 10/7 or around there. I doubt it will take that long to get this fixed. Just give them some time. Don’t get mad at everyone on the forum and Thorfire. Things could be much worse.

They see the problem and WANT to fix it. Before anyone else gets their light. This is a good thing.

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marsalla wrote:

i have not had any issues with mine but i just got it yesterday


I wanted to know if anyone can tell me how to lower the moon light mode.


Please



If you are in ramping mode, go into the menu by holding the button 8 seconds. This is shown in my video. You get 2 fast then 1 slow blink, wait, then 2 fast and 2 slow. Now you can press the button once or twice and look for the light to blink on each button press. Now just wait for it to exit and you see 4 fast blinks.

The 2 fast then 2 slower blinks means setting #2 which sets moonlight level. You have 1 to 7 different levels to chose from. Default is 3. Do if you want to go lower you can choose 1 or 2. Keep in mind that going lower might work or it might make some of thd leds not light up.

Hope that helps.

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tekwyzrd wrote:
hank wrote:
So why would the brightness be asymmetrical?
Variation between production runs?

That's pretty much it.  See the posts by Tom Tom for details, but there are two issues:

  1. The LEDs are in parallel, without individual resistors.  In this configuration, the LEDs really should be matched -- ideally, same manufacturer, same production run, and same wafer if possible.  Once you start mixing LEDs from different manufacturers/batches, all bets are off, and cases like bright/dim LEDs can certainly occur.
  2. They're operating at very low currents, which is an unspecified area ("off the datasheet" as Tom Tom puts it).  It's possible that some batches of LEDs require a higher voltage than what can be supplied by the 15K resistor, which could be the cause of flickering/off LEDs.  What works for a few prototypes might not work in production.  This is further exacerbated by the previous item.  It's also possible that Thorfire got a batch of poor quality/counterfeit LEDs (ensuring parts quality is a big issue these days).

 

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emarkd wrote:
So it seems to me that most of the reports of faulty switch LEDs goes like this:

1. Load new cells, everything works fine.
2. Play with Q8. Be amazed.
3. Turn of Q8, switch LED is now wonky.

If that’s what’s going on, has anybody tried recharging their cells to full to see if that “fixes” the switch LEDs? Seems to me that if the switch LEDs are operating right on the edge of their Vf due to too much resistance or too weak LEDs or whatever, then using the light, and thereby dropping the voltage some, could be what’s triggering the “issues”. I mean at some low voltage level all of our e-switch LEDs would go out, but due to parts tolerances maybe some are doing it much at higher voltage than expected or desired. Or maybe I’m missing something…


No, the switch lights tend to turn off within a few minutes of the light being on, like maybe 5 minutes. Not after being turned off.

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teacher wrote:
Cirnyan wrote:
if I were to try and explain how it looks, the one on the right is bright, and throwing a shadow of the outline of the part of the silicone nub that reaches down to the switch, and there's a hint of a green glow in this shadow, presumably from the other LED.
That is a perfect description..... that is exactly how one of mine looks also. Good job putting it into words. :)

Yes, again, we well understand this. I took these pics back on Sunday:

Prototype:                                    Production, unbalanced one:

      

You can clearly see on the right picture, the right LED is throwing out more light, lighting up the green PCB to the right of it. Isn't that right? We'll get this righted yet. Oh man... 

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hank wrote:
Are those pictures showing how to rotate the switch LED position?
Quote:
I rotated the switch assembly

Or — I’d assume — you need to get at the circuit board underneath the plastic cover to rotate the LEDs?

For me the brightness asymmetry is in the “if you fiddle with it long enough you’re going to break it” category
(thanks, Mom, for that good lifetime advice)


This is tricky. You have to unscrew the switch cover ring, then use some tweezers to rotate the pcb. You might need a hook tool to lift the pcb up so you can twist it slightly with your fingers. Then push it back in, add the rubber cover and screw the ring back on. It’s possible the pcb can rotate while you screw the ring back on so you have to watch it carefully. It might take a couple tries to get the lights perfect.

This is why the leds are not perfectly aligned from the factory. Its way too fiddly. Lol

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Loneman wrote:

 So on the 7th I ordered 4× 5m led strip rolls from BangGood shipped via “Standard Free Shipping”.  Not long later, within the hour at most, I ordered the 3 Q8’s with their “Priority Air Mail”.  They all shipped on the 8th and the Q8’s were pre-order numbers 1xx.  The led rolls turned up yesterday and there’s still no sign of the Q8’s.


 


Now, this isn’t a complaint, just an observation I find amusing that free, slow shipping arrived before priority air shipping.  To make the wait even more unbearable fun, we’ve had other multiple deliveries and the family are starting to tease with “Ooooh, is this your torches?  Nope, it’s my ____”  whenever a parcel arrives.  Rotten lot they are.


Are you forgetting that the Q8 ships from Thorfire and not from Banggood? I think they are in 2 different cities. No telling how far apart they are. Could be hundreds of miles apart.

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I'm quite impressed on all the lights I've seen, they got the "T" switch cover straight.

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hank wrote:
JorisFRST, if you can, please take pictures through the process of swapping the LEDs.
For those of us who need a good example to follow.

If you have a hot air station you can easily remove the old leds. If you only have one soldering iron you have to rip the old leds off. Break them in two pieces then you can unsolder each end.

You need to then clean the solder pads. Verify the direction of the new leds. Add some flux to the solder pads. Then hold the led down with tweezers. Just quickly touch each end and that should solder it in place. Verify it works before soldering and after soldering as it’s easy to get the leds turned around.

I’ve swapped leds on the switches of both lights in my sig. They are different pcb, but the basic concept is the same. There are several pictures. Hopefully that will help.

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Under normal conditions I thought my switch leds looked fairly balanced, with button cover.

Removed button…various zooms with faster shutter speeds.

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rayman007 wrote:
Mine is still working fine thankfully.

But there is one thing my OCD cant cope with and that is that fully screwed in, so it can be switched on, the lines are not lined up to the top half ;-(
How can that be fixed?

I mean like it shoul;d be either like:

Not like:

I understand exactly what you are referring to now. Thumbs Up
And while I really do not expect them to line up… I do find it refreshingly nice when the battery tube and head do line up in some discernible pattern. Smile
  • Some people don’t have a preference, no problem there.
  • Some of us do have a preference, no problem there either.

There is no right or wrong to be understood. It simply boils down to personal preference.

In fact… the majority of the lights I own have a discernible pattern of symmetry between battery tube & head.

In fact… Nitecore either indexes them during manfacturing OR I have been extremely lucky. I cannot think right now of one Nitecore light I own that does not have the symmetry we are speaking of. I own a bunch of them too.

But back to the Q8…. just the luck of the draw on this one. You’ll either have to try one of the fixes mentioned or live with it I guess. Sad

I got lucky… 2 of 3 so far have had the symmetry I like.

The third not at all…. But, it just also happens to be one that arrived DOA today.
If I had been looking for an omen I would have known it as soon as I opened the box & unwrapped it. Big Smile

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Mine arrived yesterday. Very satisfied!! Smoothest ramping ever. I wouldn’t use the Police strobe inside. Your eyeballs will let you know after. I have been carrying it for a day now. The comments from people I showed it to are all good. Switch LED’s are good but also bright. It does take getting used to the click timing. Everything works as supposed to. A couple sharp edges which I shaved down and “sharpied.” (Edge burrs fourth fin from bezel above 1/4” thread and same above switch) E lockout nice or slight turn for mechanical. I leave it powered on with switch glowing. Easy to find at night and no problems. I believe you will be VERY SATISFIED when yours arrives. I look forward to my next arrival. Throw is good as is tint. Great job on the printed cheat sheet! Best to all.

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hank wrote:
For those of you who’ve mastered the spaghetti diagram of the UI, a plea

Could you set out some of the useful series-of-clicks combinations?

For example, as noted above:

doubleclick, doubleclick, click — police strobe
doubleclick, doubleclick, doubleclick — bike “stutter” strobe


Once you get to the police strobe, you can easily cycle up and down the 5 blinky modes. Press and hold and the lights cycles backwards to regular strobe and you can then click normally to go back up to the bike strobe or beacon, etc…

Honestly, all I use is the ramping, double click to turbo and triple click for batt check. That’s all. No need to memorize anything else. Save the other stuff for reading in the manual.

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Tom E wrote:

teacher wrote:
Cirnyan wrote:
if I were to try and explain how it looks, the one on the right is bright, and throwing a shadow of the outline of the part of the silicone nub that reaches down to the switch, and there’s a hint of a green glow in this shadow, presumably from the other LED.
That is a perfect description….. that is exactly how one of mine looks also. Good job putting it into words. Smile

Yes, again, we well understand this. I took these pics back on Sunday:


Prototype:                                    Production, unbalanced one:


      


You can clearly see on the right picture, the right LED is throwing out more light, lighting up the green PCB to the right of it. Isn’t that right? We’ll get this righted yet. Oh man… 

I know y’all have it covered Tom. Thumbs Up .. I was just telling him the way he worded it painted a perfect picture with the switch cover on.
He nailed it creating a verbal image. Wink

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teacher wrote:
Q8 #2

Sigh ………

  • DOA = Dead On Arrival

Besides the detail above (and everything associated with it powering up) , all looks good. Smile
It is the same as the report of Q8 #1 , besides arrival time & power relate details.

  • Arrival time was today, 9-20-2017
  • No power related details to report

I will try to find the problem later… When I have time to get to it.


Do you mean the flashlight is doa or the switch lights are not working?

If the flashlight is doa, then that is the first reported one. They are supposed to check all flashlights at thorfire to be working or not.

Please clarify.

Thanks

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Did everybody’s questions get answered?

He asked while diving into a nearby ditch as he knows he may be bombarded with unanswered questions from weeks ago. Lol

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Are we having fun yet? Wink

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Mine arrived today. Switch lights appear to be working fine after a few hours. I do notice that one is slightly less bright than other, but only when looking up close.

The flats on the battery tube don’t exactly line up with the flats on the head, but that’s not a big deal to me.

Otherwise my only issue is my thumb not being used to the switch – I end up doing click-holds instead of double-clicks more often than not. At least I don’t need any of the double-click modes very often.

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DB Custom wrote:
Are we having fun yet? Wink

Hey, at least no one has mentioned the springs. Lol

Oh yeah, Banggood is sending me one new battery to replace the one that had the bad wrapper on it. Cool.

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Hearing that your 3rd one is DOA is real comforting, considering some of us would settle for a single unit that maybe had a off bright switch led.
Waited a year + for squat. On a list that means squat.
And What happened to the order list near the top of the OP?? Pffffffff, vanished. Funny how that happens.
Disgusted.

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darrylo wrote:

tekwyzrd wrote:
hank wrote:
So why would the brightness be asymmetrical?
Variation between production runs?

That’s pretty much it.  See the posts by Tom Tom for details, but there are two issues:



  1. The LEDs are in parallel, without individual resistors.  In this configuration, the LEDs really should be matched — ideally, same manufacturer, same production run, and same wafer if possible.  Once you start mixing LEDs from different manufacturers/batches, all bets are off, and cases like bright/dim LEDs can certainly occur.


 

My thought was two workers were tasked with placing the emitters and working from two different spools. It seems possible to me but I could be wrong but the best possibility of balanced output is sequential emitters from the spool followed by testing with a calibrated voltage/current source. In a mass test groups could be wired to power in a manner that split voltage and current and uses photos to isolate extreme variation between emitter pairs. When doing calibrations I sometimes did ‘gang’ cal of groups of low accuracy (±3% or +) voltmeters where the combined uncertainty was less than the certified accuracy of the standard. Not endorced procedure but after testing groups of meters and following up with individual tests not one failed. A superior kind of freaked out seeing me do it but every meter I passed was within tolerance when re-checked.

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hank
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Thanks tekwyzrd.
Hurray for BOINC, by the way.

So with 2 LEDs in parallel, the risk over time down the line would be if one of them dies or its connection
fails, all the current goes through the other one and fries that one? That would explain a cautious approach.

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Muto wrote:
Hearing that your 3rd one is DOA

Who are you referring to?
What do you mean by doa? The switch led or the flashlight?

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hank wrote:

So with 2 LEDs in parallel, the risk over time down the line would be if one of them dies or its connection
fails, all the current goes through the other one and fries that one? That would explain a cautious approach.

Nah, if one burned out it would be like a 7.5k resistor on the other led. It would be a bit brighter, but not burn out. I think Amplificus shorted the resistor and the leds did not blow. They just drew way too much power so the battery drain is much higher.

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Don’t be this guy/gal

Be these guys/gals

Or you could just be me

who says lighten up people.

Cheers David

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Switch leds measure 2.246v each with batteries at 4.008v. In case it matters.

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JasonWW wrote:

If you have a hot air station you can easily remove the old leds. If you only have one soldering iron you have to rip the old leds off. Break them in two pieces then you can unsolder each end.

You need to then clean the solder pads. Verify the direction of the new leds. Add some flux to the solder pads. Then hold the led down with tweezers. Just quickly touch each end and that should solder it in place. Verify it works before soldering and after soldering as it’s easy to get the leds turned around.

I’ve swapped leds on the switches of both lights in my sig. They are different pcb, but the basic concept is the same. There are several pictures. Hopefully that will help.


It’s been many years since I did this, but I have had luck in the past using two irons – one in each hand, with the tips on each pad. Use the tips of the irons like tweezers or pliers by pushing them each towards the other and lift the part off the board.

I’ve been playing with the UI and have a question since you asked JasonWW.

I am back in ramping mode, and have configured Moon mode for the lowest level.
Click and hold starts the light from a low and ramps up – as expected.
Ramping it back down, I get a switch blink at a fairly low level. – as expected.
I can select a level, turn the light off and with a single click I get the remembered mode. – as expected.
However – from off, with a medium click – I get this crazy dim moonlight level (I like it – it just does not seem to be in the cheat sheet or the doc on post 2.) This seems to be the only way to get into this level. I can’t ramp to it at all.
My eyes are a little whacked right now – mostly from the Q8, but also staring at a monitor. So I’m going to go sit in a very dark room for a while and see what this level looks like.
I’m just wondering if this is a know feature or an easter egg?

Lazy-R-us

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Just want to pass it along that ThorFire is sorry for the delay, and they think they can work out the SW LED issue quickly. Don't know, or am sure, of all the details, but sounds like they will go with a 2 resistor design, and go back to the LED's they used on the prototypes. They are also looking at some of the screw issues - no promises there though.

 

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